Exploring Marvel's Jonathan Majors' Kang Re-Casting and the Fight for Equality in Hollywood

When the real world collides with the reel, how does Marvel navigate the choppy waters of public perception and narrative continuity? We grapple with this conundrum as we address the recent legal predicaments of Jonathan Majors and the potential impact on his Marvel career. Recasting beloved characters is no easy feat; just look at cases like Edward Norton and Terrence Howard. Our chat takes us deep into the heart of fandom, where the emotional bonds with characters like Black Panther reveal just how intricate these casting decisions can become, especially when race enters the equation.

Courtrooms across America are battlegrounds where the scales of justice are often tipped by bias. In today's society, gender and racial prejudices can shape the outcomes of legal proceedings, and we dissect these disturbing truths in our latest episode. From discussing the Central Park Five to the toll taken on families fighting for the exoneration of their loved ones, we share powerful personal anecdotes and explore the moral responsibilities of legal professionals. This episode casts a critical eye on the justice system and the urgent need for systemic reform to prevent wrongful convictions.

But it's not all about Marvel and the courtroom. We also peel back the curtain on the struggles within the entertainment industry itself. This episode weaves through the nuances of maintaining one's craft amidst personal misconduct allegations, the ongoing battle for recognition faced by actors like Taraji P. Henson, and the importance of having a supportive community. As we wrap up, we leave you with thoughts on the animated world of Marvel's "What If" series and extend our warmest holiday wishes to all our listeners. Join us for a fun and interesting conversation about all things Marvel and Hollywood celebrities in general.

Links as stated in episode:

Wrongfully convicted because of legally blind "witness"
Chicago Sun Times
 
Link to Central Park Five
Link to Emmet Till

*this podcast episode is an excerpt of a nearly 2-hour episode. Other topics were discussed and we were also joined by our friend Rich. If you'd like to hear the entire episode, please check out the entire episode on Youtube.

Thank you for stopping by. Please visit our website: All About The Joy and add, like and share. We'd appreciate that greatly. Also, if you want to find us anywhere on social media, please check out the link in bio page.

Music By Geovane Bruno, Moments, 3481
Editing by Team A-J
Host, Carmen Lezeth


DISCLAIMER: As always, please do your own research and understand that the opinions in this podcast and livestream are meant for entertainment purposes only. States and other areas may have different rules and regulations governing certain aspects discussed in this podcast. Nothing in our podcast or livestream is meant to be medical or legal advice. Please use common sense, and when in doubt, ask a professional for advice, assistance, help and guidance.

Transcript

Carmen Lezeth: 0:00

Hi everyone. Welcome to All About the Joy Rick. So glad that you are here today.

Rick Costa: 0:06

Glad to be here. Glad to be here.

Carmen Lezeth: 0:08

As everyone kind of knows, and I tried to email as many people and I posted everywhere we were supposed to have some guests on the show. That was. I was actually really, really excited, but unfortunately he had to cancel and also Tommy couldn't make it. So I was just going to cancel in general and then you were like, yeah, no, no, like the show must go on, so we're just going to wing it and I think it's going to bore a lot of people to talk about what you want to talk about, but I'm on the same page, so why don't you tell me what you think first? My brother.

Rick Costa: 0:44

So if you like Marvel, you may have been following what's going on, because Marvel just fired Jonathan Majors because he was found guilty of two out of the four charges. So apparently, I think the bottom line is he unintentionally hurt his girlfriend. He didn't do it on purpose.

Carmen Lezeth: 1:03

Okay, wait, wait, wait. That's your interpretation, but okay.

Rick Costa: 1:06

That's what I heard. That's what I understood.

Carmen Lezeth: 1:08

You know what Go ahead. I'm sorry Because the two.

Rick Costa: 1:11

The other two charges that got dropped were basically no, he did what he was doing, he did on purpose. But the other ones were like no, it was he didn't he. I guess he heard it, but he didn't mean to hurt it. And I'm just like, if this was Robert Downey Jr, no, would this be happening.

Carmen Lezeth: 1:27

I don't. I don't know if that's the same thing. Robert Downey Jr didn't hurt somebody, he hurt himself, right? I mean, he was an alcoholic and a drug addict I forget what it was, but that was a different thing.

Rick Costa: 1:39

No, no, no. I mean if it was him in the exact same situation.

Carmen Lezeth: 1:42

Oh, are you thinking this is a race thing? I'm wondering, okay, and you know I'm. I'm usually not one to jump on the race thing, although I will call it out every time, even if people are resisting it, because I am a woman of color. But you know what? It's not that that didn't even cross my mind. But when you bring up Robert Downey Jr, that's probably not the best person, because his whole story the thing that makes Robert Downey Jr so great besides the fact that he's an amazing actor and is the person born to play Iron man is his story, that you know how down and out he was and then he came back. So it's kind of a hard one to use. So how about if we use somebody else?

Rick Costa: 2:23

Chris Helmsworth. Chris Helmsworth would never. That's what I'm saying.

Carmen Lezeth: 2:29

Chris Helmsworth would never. Okay, that's a better example, I guess.

Rick Costa: 2:34

Just all the evidence that I saw. Obviously I didn't see everything. I wasn't in the court.

Carmen Lezeth: 2:38

You weren't in court and it was a jury trial right. So here's my thing. I did not watch the whole trial, I did not pay attention to everything, but my whole issue is on the other side of it, because I want to trust our justice system. Here's what I'm going to say. Do we all remember what's his name? Who was the Hulk before? We don't? What's his name?

Rick Costa: 3:02

Edward Norton was the Hulk, oh yeah.

Carmen Lezeth: 3:05

And after that, one movie of the Hulk. He then was no longer the Hulk, and we have who. What's his name? Our beautiful man that we love?

Rick Costa: 3:13

You mean that one now with other ones? Yes, there was three, there was three.

Carmen Lezeth: 3:16

No, our Hulk, the only Hulk that matters.

Rick Costa: 3:18

Mark Ruffalo.

Carmen Lezeth: 3:19

Yes, okay. So Iron man, his right hand man, his right hand guy, what's his name? The first movie it wasn't him, and then it's.

Rick Costa: 3:30

Oh, okay, the current one.

Carmen Lezeth: 3:32

That's right Okay.

Rick Costa: 3:35

Tony was here. He probably knew the names.

Carmen Lezeth: 3:36

He's gonna be here later. He said he's gonna stop by, but parents.

Rick Costa: 3:39

Howard was the first one.

Carmen Lezeth: 3:40

That's right. And then he got upset, or the story is, he wanted as much money as Robert Downey Jr and they were like bye, bye, we're recasting you. And again, I'm not trying to be mean, but even back then Robert Downey Jr was Robert Downey Jr. You know what I mean. So, but, props to him. But yeah, whoever was cast now I forget his name because I have not prepared clearly for this conversation, but I'm not so worried about the recast of his character. I guess is what I'm saying.

Rick Costa: 4:13

But have they definitely decided to do that though?

Carmen Lezeth: 4:16

Oh, they're going to. I think they will.

Rick Costa: 4:18

Because they said they could just take a whole different direction and just not do a cameo.

Carmen Lezeth: 4:23

I mean they could do that. I mean, look it, I think time will tell. Jonathan majors is a great actor and kind of like, you know, chad Chadwick Boseman Is that his last name? Black Panther, you know it's really hard to see anybody else in these roles, but time is moving on and, as we know from Black Panther, from the second one, from Wakanda Forever, we know that there's going to be another Black Panther, you know what I mean. So that so they're doing what they need to do to kind of change the roles.

Rick Costa: 4:55

Marvolo at the time said period point blank. We are not recasting. That's what they said before.

Carmen Lezeth: 5:01

They've been black Panther About.

Rick Costa: 5:03

Black Panther. They said absolutely.

Carmen Lezeth: 5:05

Wakanda Forever.

Rick Costa: 5:07

Well, they have the kid now, but that's not going to be Black Panther?

Carmen Lezeth: 5:10

Are you confused by this?

Rick Costa: 5:11

No, but he's not the dad, he's the kid. He's a different person, different character.

Carmen Lezeth: 5:15

You're saying he's a different Black Panther and that matters to you because they made a continuation. Yeah, it matters, you're saying so. You're saying like if they had, like, a Black Panther 3 and they recast Chadwick Boseman, you would be against that.

Rick Costa: 5:28

I don't know if I'd be against it, but some people would.

Carmen Lezeth: 5:31

But you're upset about Jonathan Majors. I love how connected you are to him.

Rick Costa: 5:35

Jonathan Majors. I think he's awesome, like everything I've seen him in, which isn't a lot, but what I've seen him in he's amazing, he's great. And I'm sorry I keep seeing this big Black man running from the skinny white woman and I'm like, and he's the aggressor, he's literally like he's running for his life. I'm like, just don't compute, what are you?

Carmen Lezeth: 5:55

doing so. Listen, here's the thing. Okay, so can we just admit to something right now? You and I were not there and I want to believe in our justice system. It's hard, but we need to bring back a way to believe in our institutions that keep us as a civil society. So let's start with the premise that he was found guilty and that happened. Just for this conversation, let's just pretend that we agree. I agree with whatever the justice system decided. Let's talk about the second part of this, which I think actually is something. I understand why you don't want him recast. Right, you can admit that they can recast him. You're upset about the justice system part.

Rick Costa: 6:43

I'm not even saying that I'm upset about him being recast or not, I'm just saying what I heard, what I had. Marvel was saying that they might just nix the whole because with the end of Loki they kind of put a bow on it there.

Carmen Lezeth: 6:57

They kind of put a bow on it so they can admit it.

Rick Costa: 7:00

So they already knew ahead of time, like, just in case, let's just wrap this up.

Carmen Lezeth: 7:04

Oh wait, wait, wait, I'm sure they did that a while ago, though, because you know. So again, I want to. I'm not trying to be condescending my nameines, but movies are not made in, you know, three months. This movie had already been done a long time ago, before this even came to fruition, I'm positive. So that is not why they wrapped it up or put a bow on it. You know what I mean. Like that, they left it open so that he could come back. You know what I mean.

Rick Costa: 7:30

So but I just saw somebody. It was really funny and amusing. I was like, hmm, I could maybe see that somebody. You know, people put faces on a different thing. They did Kang, but they did it as Denzel Washington.

Carmen Lezeth: 7:43

I was like hmm, Okay, but Denzel's like no offense but is it any like 65 now or something?

Rick Costa: 7:50

I mean, I don't think Kang is supposed to be a young character in the comics anyway.

Carmen Lezeth: 7:54

Oh, I don't know the comics. Okay, I don't have a wall of Marvel behind me, so I'm not going to claim to know anything more than you do. Okay, but there are a lot of the other young, vibrant, wonderful men who could play that role. Dare, I say women, but you know what I mean. Like there are other people out there. Here's my thing, rick. I did not follow the trial. I understand what you're saying. I think you're not upset with recasting the role. You're upset for the reason why. That's what it sounds like. You don't think it's fair?

Rick Costa: 8:25

I mean I don't know. Look, marvel was. I think Marvel was trying to be reasonable and they were like you know, until it the trial happened, there was no talking. Firing him. Put the minute bone.

Carmen Lezeth: 8:36

Well, well, because they were giving him due diligence, right, innocent and to prove and guilty is enough what we say we want all the time. Yeah, yeah okay, let me ask you this if you and I are working together and I'm convicted of Beating someone to a pulp, that they end up in the hospital and I'm like, okay, rick, we're gonna do our show next week, are you coming on? I'm just asking are you coming on the show? All about the joy.

Rick Costa: 9:05

I was arrested and. Is it gonna be an apologetic one?

Carmen Lezeth: 9:10

I'm going to apologize, but I beat someone to a pulp, almost to their death or something. Let's just say they're in the hospital or hurting whatever, and it's been in the news and I'm convicted, but I'm released on my own recognizance or whatever. Okay, whatever, are you coming back on the show maybe? Look at it's a business, right, and your reputation matters and I, I hear you. But the reason why marvel did what they did, they wanted to keep him and and of course, they wanted to do the right thing and I'm I have to defend a corporation. You see what you make me do, but I actually don't find them at fault for letting him go. I, whatever the reasonings were for whatever he did, what he did and whatever the jury found and whatever they convicted him of, I don't fault marvel for being and his talent that was the biggest one for me was that his talent agency Dropped him. You know, I mean they all.

Rick Costa: 10:09

I mean he got dropped everywhere Pretty much everybody except marvel dropped him until the verdict right, but I, you know, look at it.

Carmen Lezeth: 10:17

I think this is a business, and and I'm not surprised either. Just yeah, I'm not surprised either, but I love that you're so sad for him.

Rick Costa: 10:27

He's a great actor. And then somebody was joking like oh, tyler Perry will take him, he'll make movies with Tyler. I was like, okay, maybe you know he's gonna look at, he's gonna be fine.

Carmen Lezeth: 10:37

I mean, I hate to say this. I'm more concerned about all of poor young people who end up in prison or end up because they don't have great legal counsel or whatever, and you know, and then afterwards end up jailed or whatever for unfair blah, blah, blah. I was just reading a thing today I think it was in the LA Times of these people who were just released, like after 32 years, after 42 years, and they were innocent, but they had like, okay, one guy I this was actually I don't think it was the LA Times, it was the California Sun, I was reading it this morning and they were saying that a man was in jail for 12 years, 12 years of his life. He was a teenager when he went in. He got out today because they relied on the witness Like they're you know that they saw an eyewitness account and they were able to prove that the eyewitness is legally blind and can't see like two feet in front of him, right. So and and the way he was exonerated and I'll send you this link because I just read it today was because his cellmate, like his cellmate was is you know, he's in there studying the law and was like wait a minute, this doesn't seem right, you need to have this checked out. And that's how he ended up getting and he got released, like this week.

Carmen Lezeth: 11:55

Wow, you're talking about a young man who was a teenager and you know, I mean so when, when we and this is not to say you know, celebrities don't go through things or whatever but when you have money, when you have the ability to afford whatever, it is therapy Lawyers, blah, blah, blah. I'm good, um, I'm. I'm sorry You're going through what you're going through. I wish you well, you know, but I'm not as concerned with them, um, I'm more concerned with people who have nothing and end up suffering, even if they did something Right, even if somebody made a mistake or committed a crime of some sort. It's more likely if you are poor that you will end up in jail than if you are rich. True, and that is not fair. That, to me, bothers me, but, but I think marvel's gonna be okay. I think k ain't gonna be okay. I think we're gonna recast. I'm sorry, I know what you think. Give it some time. They, that was a great, that's a great character.

Rick Costa: 12:53

Yeah.

Carmen Lezeth: 12:54

And no offense with marvel marvel has been getting on our nerves lately. They're not gonna put that away and throw. It'd be like we're gonna go a different way. They will pull that out the minute they think they can find the right person and the good thing.

Rick Costa: 13:06

Thanks again to Loki and the tva. He's, there's variants. Freakin silvi is the Loki variant, a totally different person and a female, exactly exactly so they can literally do anything.

Carmen Lezeth: 13:18

Yeah, but I love that you're upset about the the justice system and he. You think he shouldn't have been convicted.

Rick Costa: 13:24

I mean from everything that I saw, I'm like Y'all crazy like really okay, what did you see?

Carmen Lezeth: 13:29

because I didn't see it all. So what did you see?

Rick Costa: 13:31

So, besides the running, the driver, who is not attached to either one of them personally, said she was being the aggressor, you know, and he was just trying to be like yo stop because you know the whole. She saw text on his phone that said I wish I'd be kissing you. That could be anybody. A random weirdo fan said that you don't know he's a famous, could be anybody. She told it all seriously, that could be anybody. So I think she overreacted. I mean, I understand it because it's like you know, I guess, my man, what am I doing?

Tony D. : 14:06

That's the guy, that's the first, below any first reaction.

Rick Costa: 14:10

But and then the whole when she was with these other people, when he like, yes, he really took off. And then she ended up being with these other people, went to the club, was partying, blah, blah, blah. Meanwhile she's so injured and she hurt her finger and da, da, da, da da. I'm like listen, if you in that much pain, we're gonna go party, you gonna go home or go to hospital, like it. Just too many things didn't make sense to me.

Carmen Lezeth: 14:31

Okay. So why do you think from your perspective Because you clearly watched it and paid attention to it more than I have him, when I admit right there why do you think they might have? You think it's because she was a woman and he was a man, or is she? Is she a white woman and he's a black?

Rick Costa: 14:44

man. She's a British white woman. So you know how Americans are British like. Oh, you know I love your accent Da, da, da like. And then you sound truthful because you're British like. It's stupid. But oh, oh interesting but um, I don't know, might have been taken that way.

Rick Costa: 15:03

You think some of that I hate to say it, but it's like ooh, the big, angry, scary black man attacked the British white lady. That's kind of how I'm looking at it. I could be totally wrong, but I don't know why they voted how they did. I really don't get it.

Carmen Lezeth: 15:19

Was it a full jury or was it a judge?

Rick Costa: 15:22

I believe it was six. Yes, it was jury, I think three men, three women. I don't know what they're six, isn't that always 12? Is it? I don't know, maybe I'm wrong.

Carmen Lezeth: 15:31

I think it's always 12.

Rick Costa: 15:33

Okay.

Carmen Lezeth: 15:34

I mean I? I mean the juries. I've been on hey Google. How many jurors have to be on a jury for a case in court? It's 12 12,.

Rick Costa: 15:44

Okay, yeah, I'm on the majority.

Carmen Lezeth: 15:48

Well, where was it? Was it in California?

Rick Costa: 15:51

I think New York.

Carmen Lezeth: 15:52

Yeah, it's probably 12. I think it's always 12.

Rick Costa: 15:55

I think it's always 12 Well either way, I think I'm pretty sure it was split as far as gender, like half male, half female. Okay, thank you, melanie. Thank you, thank you.

Carmen Lezeth: 16:05

Yeah, I think it's 12.

Rick Costa: 16:06

I don't know what their races were.

Carmen Lezeth: 16:07

I you know, I really want to live in a world where it isn't about race. But you're not wrong and God knows I'm. You know what I mean. Like I do think there is something to be said for, and andray and I talk about this all the time it's not a popular point of view, but you know how, like it's always like always believe the woman, always believe. You know what I mean Like it's always believe the woman. And sometimes you know that scale tips over a little bit and you're like Okay, you know what. You can't be doing a BCND and not have any responsibility to this and then expect All this to happen and you have no responsibility to it whatsoever. You know, but it's a really touchy subject because For so long women were never believed. You know what I mean and that's kind of where the weird thing is. Like you know, yeah, I also and again, I didn't watch it, so you can tell me look at Cynthia just throwing it out there. I'm trying to be all diplomatic. I'm buying it too. You ain't wrong, game wrong, look it.

Carmen Lezeth: 17:15

I have a dear, beautiful friend who's a family member of mine, who I love with all my heart, who we've had this conversation because his brother was for so long accused by a woman and I Know for a fact his brother would have never in a million you know what I mean Like I can't even imagine it and but it ruined his reputation and it ruined his life and it put him in therapy and Then she retracted it, you know, like she Apologized to him, but it this went on for years. So I think, because I know that story on a firsthand basis, I'm always, you know, like we have to get to that place where we're not just always believe in the woman, like there has to be evidence, it has to be, you know, but it's also because it's not, we're never believed. Women are never believed. So we're in a weird place, you know. It's the same thing with race, you know.

Carmen Lezeth: 18:12

I don't want everything to be about race, but until we get to that place.

Rick Costa: 18:16

Like wasn't it Emmett? Till that the lady, almost like when she got to enter her life, she finally admitted oh yeah, that didn't happen, I'm like the elevator right.

Carmen Lezeth: 18:25

She accused that's yeah. I don't know the story of Emmett till, but you should watch.

Rick Costa: 18:31

It's like when somebody goes to jail for years and years and years and then you find out oops, you were innocent. Like how do you pay back the mistreatment of him going to jail? Like?

Carmen Lezeth: 18:40

wait, can we talk about something else though?

Rick Costa: 18:43

Sure.

Carmen Lezeth: 18:43

How can you be the person to convict somebody Knowing you're not sure, like the, the, the eyewitness account of that story that I just told you about, that I read in the California Sun today. The person is legally blind. So how did the defense or the you know, I mean the prosecutors how did and how did that person be okay, knowing they sent a poor young man to jail? All right, how do you live with yourself? And how did nobody know how?

Rick Costa: 19:14

did nobody know the person was legally blind. How does that not come out like did he be? Like the lawyer was like, listen, don't wear glasses, don't know, just go up the arousal.

Carmen Lezeth: 19:23

I don't bubbing enough, like I don't get it you do know because, first of all, if you're put so, let's talk from his point of view, from the person who was convicted. If you're poor, you're gonna get some newbie lawyer who may not intentionally be Horrible, but if you're new, you don't know what you're doing Right, so you're trying to defend somebody. You also, if you're a public defender, you don't have a lot of money and resources. You don't have investigators. You know. You know. You see where it's going here. And, yeah, I was having a conversation with one of my brother-in-law's, greg, when I was visiting Back east and we were talking about if his son had been convicted of anything, what would you do to get him out? We would do anything and everything to get this child out. Right, with all of our connections with whatever we got, we would do whatever. Not once did we say you know what? But did he do it? It would right, because family you go, you're gonna be like do whatever you got to do to get your child out.

Rick Costa: 20:26

Mm-hmm.

Carmen Lezeth: 20:27

So that's how it happens. And when you have a lot of money and I'm not saying this person's not right, but when you have a lot of money, yes, it's like the story of the Central Park five. Yes, exactly, cynthia. When you have a lot of money, though, you can put anybody you want away and you don't have to think about it, and you can hire doctors and experts and Scientists and whatever. Do you know this? The story of Central Park five?

Carmen Lezeth: 20:51

I'm not sure so the Central Park. Five were these young men who were accused of I think it was rape, rape and Brutally beating this woman. She did not die, she was a runner in Central Park and these young kids five of them were accused and put in prison For doing this to her. She was running in Central Park and I could be wrong on all of this because, again, not prepared for this Episode, I always do my reading, but she was running at night. She's a white woman, they were all black, of course, and she was brutally raped and hurt or whatever. And they accused these five young men and put them in prison when they were teenagers and they ended up. They ended up getting out like I don't even know how long it was, but a long time they were adults. And the reason why it came up again recently is because Donald Trump at the time and again, and even to this day, again we're not gonna talk about politics, but this is an example Well, no, because that I mean. That's why everybody kind of brings it up again, because it came up again Actually put out an ad in the paper saying that you know, yes, they should be convicted.

Carmen Lezeth: 22:05

Yes, they are bad people. Yes, they did it, you know. I mean like and kind of doubled down on it with the power of the presidency, you know, and they were found to be not guilty and even the runner herself is unclear and unsure. Wow, who did it? So I mean, imagine being beat up by five people.

Carmen Lezeth: 22:25

I don't want to talk about the rape part, but just imagine, of course you're traumatized, how you gonna know everybody and supposedly you know there are all these things. It was that nice. They didn't do it. They were told by their lawyers to plead guilty so they would get a let, get less of punishment. That's poverty. Right there you have lawyers who are telling you to plead guilty. That's right, cynthia, I forgot that part. Thank you, baby.

Carmen Lezeth: 22:45

That's the other part. They pleaded guilty, cuz and like they did all the stuff you would think, keeping them up all day and all night, you know, interrogating them over and over and over again, and all the things that you would think that you see on, like CSI or we're law and order, all those shows. That's where, kind of all that's thumbs from. I mean, and they went through all that and they were kids. Imagine your child, your son, being locked away from his parents with no one who's really advocating for them. And they're being kept up all night. They're hungry, not eating whatever, and they're being interrogated over and over and over again, being told you know, it'll be easier for you, son, it'll be easier for you if you just admit it. Look at, it'll be easier. You'll just be in a regular jail. You won't be in solitary confinement and you're lacking sleep or whatever. Come on, come on.

Rick Costa: 23:32

That's crazy. You know how it happens, baby, you know how it happens and that's why you always see, like in Movies and shows, when it's like a rich bad guy and they get caught and they always smile. They were like I'll be out before the end of the day because they will yeah.

Carmen Lezeth: 23:46

Because they have the right lawyers in place, you know. So there there is something wrong with our justice system, and I I don't know the parameters of what happened with Mr Majors I don't what's his name.

Rick Costa: 23:58

Again, Jonathan, majors Jonathan majors, right.

Carmen Lezeth: 24:01

Okay, I think for me, what bothers me, and this, this is this. I will say this is not against him, but it's just in general, when you are, when did this happen exactly? I don't even know when it's happened. You're already famous. Yeah, I want to say in the spring maybe and this is a girlfriend right, not even a wife or I think she live with him yeah but so here's, here's my thing.

Carmen Lezeth: 24:25

When you become a celebrity, you need to be Extremely, extremely brilliant and smart and careful of who you put around yourself. And that is a really hard thing to do, because fame is incredibly enticing and Powerful feeling and and I had a taste of it like this much I'm talking about, like this and I was a kid and you know I thought I was famous in the world. I was just famous in my community, doesn't matter. I have not forgotten that feeling. But even when you're on stage and and the audience, there is that feeling.

Carmen Lezeth: 25:01

And I know you've experienced this, rick, because you've been on stage singing in your choir, where you know what I'm talking about. So imagine if it's every day and things are taking care of you, of you. You know people around you, you have bodyguards, you have like all. It's a whole different ballgame that I have never experienced. It is a very powerful thing. But that is when you have to be, or you have to have somebody in your corner telling you that's not the right person to be dating and you need to listen to those people.

Carmen Lezeth: 25:32

Yeah, true you cannot play with that, you know, so yeah and I think he's gonna.

Rick Costa: 25:39

What do you call it when you go?

Carmen Lezeth: 25:41

back.

Rick Costa: 25:42

Yeah, I couldn't think of that word. But yeah, he's gonna try to appeal it and you know, see what happens. That'll be interesting. If he does and he wins, then what's Marvel gonna do?

Carmen Lezeth: 25:50

Well, it doesn't matter now because his rep so business-wise, his reputation has been ruined, okay, and they would be hard for them to take. So again we go back to the example. I've beaten someone to a pope. I was mad. They called me the and word Did it, did it whatever. I can justify it, however I want. Okay, he touched me in the wrong place and we were at a bar, like I just, but he almost died. Okay, let's say he almost died or whatever, and then I'm exonerated. Do you have me back? You know, are you gonna work with me on my show? I Mean if you're exonerated, hey.

Carmen Lezeth: 26:24

I mean, but my reputation's ruined and it's gonna rub off on you. I don't know. I mean I mean we don't.

Rick Costa: 26:33

honestly and this is me, yes, you are my friend, I really don't give a rip about. But nobody else thinks I want to be on the show and y'all don't like it. You can go kick rocks, okay.

Carmen Lezeth: 26:49

That was a good answer, so.

Rick Costa: 26:53

No, I'm just saying.

Carmen Lezeth: 26:55

People talk about forgiveness right, we were talking about a little bit last time, but we don't. We don't really do well with it. Yeah, the Jesus Bob will head would be very close. But yeah, okay, what else you got did you see about to Raji? Okay, why don't you share what you know, and then I'll tell you what I know.

Rick Costa: 27:19

I mean, it was hard to even watch because she got so emotional I justifiably, and she even cussed a little bit. I was like, oh, I don't usually hear custom, but anyway, god, I'm used to seeing her like. Tyler Perry stuff where it's all clean Whatever right and also that show.

Carmen Lezeth: 27:34

I mean, you're watching clips that were not edited, but she was being interviewed by a, by what's her name? Gay CBS, whatever does, doesn't matter by I don't remember, but she's like, you know it's.

Rick Costa: 27:47

It's ridiculous. That's like she can do really really well. You know everybody loves her, da, da, da. But then when she stops and she goes to a new project, it's like she's starting at ground zero all over again and everything she did means nothing. Like. You treat me like I'm brand new, like, and it's ridiculous. She's like I'm sick of this and she's like and I'm not doing this just for me, I'm doing this for everybody coming up behind me and it's like.

Carmen Lezeth: 28:10

It was very emotional, yeah it was very emotional, so I'm gonna try the rest of it. So just to give people Information. So if you don't know who to Raji, is it P Henson? P, I think, soj. Anyway, she's in the color purple. She gonna be in the color purple and it's coming out December 25th. You should go watch it.

Tony D. : 28:29

You should be remarkable.

Carmen Lezeth: 28:31

She plays Sugar Avery and she's so cute. The way she said because people are like we didn't know you could sing, but I loved that. She said I can sing but she can't sing Like she can sing one time. I totally get it Like her voice isn't going to last over and over and over. I love that because I've never heard anyone talk like that about singing and I was like I totally get it, you know, because your voice you lose it after a while, you know.

Rick Costa: 29:02

So if you're not a trained singer, you know as you know, what's funny is not funny but like. So you know, in my broadcast I sing everyone right. But it's getting hard now because before, when I was living by myself, she said when I was living by myself, I would sing all the time in the car driver on a sing, all the time, like I'm always. Because my mother said, before you could talk you were singing, singing is a huge part of what I am.

Rick Costa: 29:30

And now I have to be quiet. I can't make noise because she gets wild up and I have I'm used to like upstairs my speakers are blasting that. I can't do that here. Everything has to be headphones. I can't make any noise because she gets confused and round up.

Carmen Lezeth: 29:46

So it's like so I'm not singing anymore, except when I broadcast.

Rick Costa: 29:50

And now it's like I have to keep drinking and putting cough drops in my mouth Cause like my throat can't take it.

Carmen Lezeth: 29:55

Yeah, cause people don't understand. Like to be a singer like Whitney Houston or Barbara Streisand or you know what you do. You need to be working on your tool all the time. It's like anything else you're going to lose it If you're not working on it all the time. That's like I didn't even realize you were going through that. Yeah, that made such sense.

Rick Costa: 30:16

I think I've heard Taraji singing on like some Tyler Perry stuff.

Carmen Lezeth: 30:19

Oh, yeah, I know she has, but what she was saying was cause people kept telling her like oh, we didn't know you could sing girl Like you should be. She's like no, no, I'm not that kind of singer, it's kind of like when people talk about.

Carmen Lezeth: 30:27

You know cause people say I'm funny. They're like you should be a comedian. Like now, I could never write out a comedic and get on stage and be funny. I'm just funny Sometimes in the moment, in a crowd. That's not the same. Like you know your skill level, you know what I mean.

Rick Costa: 30:46

Like she's not going to be doing a Broadway musical anytime soon. Well, she might.

Carmen Lezeth: 30:50

I don't know if she can. She can kind of do anything. She's a great actress. I don't know if she can work on that tool, I have no idea, but she would probably say right now no. But here's the part that that. Let me just give a little bit, a little bit of a tweak of what you said, cause I think it's important.

Carmen Lezeth: 31:04

What she was talking about was that, as a woman of color she didn't say this, by the way, but we all read between the lines cause we knew what she was saying oh yeah, as a woman of color, people get on her because they'll say she made $10 million or she made $2 million, and people don't understand that what you're seeing is work with a whole group of people. So she has to pay. So, first of all, uncle Sam takes 50%, so 10 million is now 5 million, and then she has to pay her staff, which is like 2.5 million or whatever it is Right. So now we're at 2.5. I don't she, she did the numbers, she was doing her own numbers, whatever. It's just to pay her staff, which is the makeup people, the hair people. Her managers take, okay, managers take 15%. Oh no, I'm sorry, it manages. Take 5%. I guess at that level. It depends on what you negotiate, like with me it would be 10%, but managers take 5% and then her agents take 15%. So you dwindle that down and now she's maybe at what? A million or 500,000, and anyone on the planet would be like, yeah, what's wrong with that? You know cause, cause we're over here making our 60,000 or our 30,000 or whatever, so we're all crazed about it. Tony just said I appreciate her, right.

Carmen Lezeth: 32:21

When she broke down the numbers, it was awesome. So she got really emotional. She was crying cause she was saying, if I can't, oh wait, let me finish. So she broke down the numbers to let people know. And then she said you know what? And then every time I go to renegotiate and what she didn't say, but other people said, are white women or white men Get 10 times more than a black woman does? And what she said was every time I go to renegotiate, they throw in my face, I'm not marketable elsewhere. I don't relate to other people internationally, which is something. And she's been doing this for what? 10, 15, 20 years or something. And she started crying. And because she said if I, with all of that power and prestige, if I can't get this so that we're getting paid or whatever. How is anyone else coming up behind me going to do it? It was and it was very emotional, but it gets worse.

Carmen Lezeth: 33:21

I don't know if you saw TikTok today. I saw a couple of things on TikTok where people were watching them at a press junket so all of the cast and Oprah, who's been on every press junket or whatever, and people were looking at the body language and clearly there's something going on between Taraji and Oprah or whatever. I'm not going to analyze it because I that's not what I do, but you know, it's kind of like if you and I have a spat and then we have to do the show, we might be a little like hi, rick, how you doing, and people might be people who watch us regularly might be like, okay, something's open to you, yeah, yeah, like whatever.

Rick Costa: 33:58

I'm not going to hide it as best you can, but people are like they see through it.

Carmen Lezeth: 34:01

Oh yeah they can see it right, so, but? But you know, on TikTok people are slow motioned but they're not wrong. There's something going on. You know what I mean. But I actually think that what she said was profound. I thought it needed to be said. She didn't say it was different between white and black, she did not say that. Or women and men. She did not say that. But that is the inference that you know. It's kind of like violating. It's kind of like Viola Davis. Viola Davis, if you don't know who she is, I mean you should. You know what. I'm not going to do that, because y'all shouldn't know who Viola Davis is. If you don't Google her cause, I'm done. You know what I mean. She has said that a million times. A million times. She does not get the same amount of money as Meryl Streep does, right, and you know what? As somebody who just watches people and appreciates acting and I love the art of acting you are not going to tell me Viola Davis is not as good as Meryl Streep.

Rick Costa: 34:56

She is amazing, she is amazing. She is amazing I watched that show where she was the lawyer and training up the younger lawyers. What's that called About murder?

Carmen Lezeth: 35:04

or something. Something with murder, murder or something, something with murder I watched a couple of episodes and that wasn't my. It's not my genre. It's not my genre.

Rick Costa: 35:12

Yeah, but she was great at that, she was amazing.

Carmen Lezeth: 35:15

That was her breakout. That was her first breakout thing Getting away with murder. That's right, cynthia, on it tonight. I'm glad you feeling better girl.

Rick Costa: 35:27

We need Cynthia.

Carmen Lezeth: 35:29

Yeah, I'm just glad she's feeling better, because I was worried about it so much. What else you got coming up as far as movies or shows you want to see?

Rick Costa: 35:37

Oh, yes, next. Oh how there's more drama with Deadpool. Ryan Reynolds went off, I guess, on Igor, what are you?

Carmen Lezeth: 35:46

talking about.

Rick Costa: 35:46

Igor, what's his name? That's like the head of Disney or something I think he had a beef.

Carmen Lezeth: 35:52

No, they didn't. Are you serious?

Rick Costa: 35:53

Yeah, and so I'm like listen, wait till your movie comes out and then yell at him what was he yelling at Ryan Reynolds?

Carmen Lezeth: 36:00

ain't yelling at nobody. Was he being funny or sarcastic?

Rick Costa: 36:03

I don't know, but they have some kind of beef. I don't know. I don't know what it was, I didn't pay attention that hard, but yeah, some kind of beef with them.

Carmen Lezeth: 36:10

All about the joy where you get all the gossip on anything Marvel.

Rick Costa: 36:14

Oh, the tea, I've been here.

Carmen Lezeth: 36:17

We're going to give you all the gossip all the time on Marvel, but it's interesting because it's literally the only Marvel, not Sony, because Spider-Man got you know.

Rick Costa: 36:27

It's not Sony, only Marvel movie in 2024 is. Deadpool, that's it.

Carmen Lezeth: 36:31

Is it really that the only one coming out?

Rick Costa: 36:32

It's the only one. Everything else is fine.

Carmen Lezeth: 36:34

Yeah, it's just a writer's strike and the writer's and actor's strike, so everything got pushed back. Two of the clients I work for we just did projections for January through March and we're getting hit now because you know what I mean, but it's gonna be okay because it's over with. But you start to see the trickle down of how you get hit with that. So I didn't realize Deadpool was the only movie coming, are you sure?

Rick Costa: 36:59

Movie, now TV shows, there's other, there's shows coming out. What?

Carmen Lezeth: 37:02

TV shows are coming out. Do you know?

Rick Costa: 37:04

I don't know that.

Carmen Lezeth: 37:04

I might be interested in.

Rick Costa: 37:05

I know the times, but did you like the Scarlet Witch and Vision one? I did not.

Carmen Lezeth: 37:12

I was the only one, I think, that didn't love that. Everyone loved it. It was so quirky. But I didn't love the because you had to watch a few episodes to understand what was happening.

Rick Costa: 37:22

Yeah, so there's a spin-off with Agatha, which is the bad person?

Carmen Lezeth: 37:26

Ooh, but I liked her.

Rick Costa: 37:27

But you didn't know until the end. It's like, oh, and then they made that song. It was Agatha. Oh, love, oh. Right right right, it was such a great song.

Carmen Lezeth: 37:35

Yeah, and I liked her.

Rick Costa: 37:36

But yeah, she's gonna get a show and people are wondering, ooh, is the Scarlet Witch gonna come back in her show? Maybe I don't know, but try and think what else. They have a lot of things in the work. I mean they've been talking about doing like young Avengers, like Teenage Avengers, teenage.

Carmen Lezeth: 37:50

Wars. Oh God, no, please don't. I mean, I think, actually think they need to stop doing so much. It's a lot. I think they need to back it up, like because it's becoming its own genre and it's becoming boring. Oh, and now?

Rick Costa: 38:07

yeah, now the animated what If, which is why I saw you write what If before I was like oh you go talk about that. They're gonna be showing it, for I don't know if it starts today or tomorrow, but it's like one episode a day for Christmas. I think it might be starting either today or tomorrow.

Carmen Lezeth: 38:23

Where.

Rick Costa: 38:23

Where I'm assuming that's on Disney Plus, I assume.

Carmen Lezeth: 38:26

On Disney Plus. Yeah.

Rick Costa: 38:27

So, yeah, one a day instead of one a week, it's literally one a day, like they're doing it for Christmas. And I saw the previous and like, oh, some interesting stuff in there.

Carmen Lezeth: 38:36

Yeah, I'm not into the animated things as much, I'm just not. I try, you know what I mean. But I mean I love Marvel. But I was kind of okay, don't hate me, I was kind of done with Endgame and you know what, every time I see a clip because somebody on TikTok always puts the clip of it's two parts either Robert Downey Jr, I am Iron man or whatever I am inevitable, whatever that whole scene, but the clip that always gets me, it doesn't matter how many times I see it, is when Captain America picks up Thor's hammer. Right, because you don't know the way they shoot. It is so great because you see the hammer. You know that Thor has been laid out by what's his name again, what's that horrible name?

Rick Costa: 39:27

The Kathanos.

Carmen Lezeth: 39:29

Thanos. He's been laid out by Thanos, right, they've been fighting. He's been laid out and the hammer's there and they shoot it the way they. I mean, I just love the art of filmmaking, right, the way you see the hammer and then all of a sudden it's picked up.

Rick Costa: 39:43

And you see who picked it up.

Carmen Lezeth: 39:45

And you're like, oh my God, because it means he's so worthy and we knew he was. Because if you watch Stargate, oh Stargate, sorry If you watch Avengers, don't tell me it's Avengers.

Rick Costa: 40:02

I don't know the name, but I know what you're talking about.

Carmen Lezeth: 40:03

It's the one where vision it's the one with vision yeah where he first showed up. Yeah, Right, it's, it's.

Rick Costa: 40:09

Because he's like you can't pick it up.

Carmen Lezeth: 40:11

You can't pick it up and he nudged it and he did it.

Rick Costa: 40:13

it moved a little bit and he and quote Thor's face was like oh crap.

Carmen Lezeth: 40:17

Only Thor saw that, though that he kind of nudged it, you know, and he was like yeah, yeah, yeah, he did it.

Rick Costa: 40:25

Yeah, no, I can't let that Every time I see that episode every time. I saw a video yesterday.

Carmen Lezeth: 40:31

That TikTok I get like teary eyed Cause it was, that was a grip, you know what. That's why I get mad at like Martin Scorsese and stuff. I have not since then see Age of.

Rick Costa: 40:42

Ultron Look at Cynthia. Let me help you. That's why we need Cynthia here.

Carmen Lezeth: 40:46

That's why we need Cynthia. Yeah, Age of Ultron, that's right. Avengers, Age of Ultron. So this is what I'm saying when I get mad at Martin Scorsese when they talk about it not being real movies or real good whatever. I have yet, since Endgame, had an experience like that in a movie theater, where I am completely consumed in the moment of the story and cheering and crying because we're winning.

Rick Costa: 41:17

Right, there was one scene in the one with the three Spider-Men, with all three of them, yeah, and that was.

Carmen Lezeth: 41:26

that was very close. Oh, no, no, no, you're right, right, right, when the three of us were, you not?

Rick Costa: 41:29

in it. That was very close. Right when MJ is falling and Andrew Garfield different Spider-Man he's like, oh, we ain't doing this again. It dives in and I saw a video of people in the theater and the people are like they were screaming, all crazy and, I'm not gonna lie, I teared up.

Carmen Lezeth: 41:48

I'm saying you know what you're right, you know what I mean, though. I meant it more about, like Martin Scorsese, not understanding and appreciating, but you're right, that was great. That's my call. That was an awesome moment as well.

Rick Costa: 42:01

I think Martin's just old.

Carmen Lezeth: 42:03

Is it old? Is it old? Steven Spielberg is old and he doesn't say that he's always been hip. Oh my God, okay, you just made yourself look old.

Rick Costa: 42:11

I said he's always been hip.

Carmen Lezeth: 42:13

I'm just gonna throw that out, but here's what I think it is. I'm stuttering a lot tonight, but it's okay. I don't think it's the hip thing. Let's not use that word ever again. No just kidding Cause all the youngins are gonna be like man them motherfucking old oh.

Rick Costa: 42:29

I swore.

Carmen Lezeth: 42:30

once I was trying not to swear, I don't know but you did good.

Rick Costa: 42:32

so far, though, I've been doing good, though, right. Listen, these young people got their new words. We can bring up our old words. I'm about like oh, you got the drip, the one, you got the drip.

Carmen Lezeth: 42:43

No, no. My favorite one is what is it Like, biz?

Rick Costa: 42:47

I don't even understand half these words these kids use.

Carmen Lezeth: 42:50

Well, wait, but wait. Here's what I was gonna say. I think Steven Spielberg is more childlike.

Carmen Lezeth: 42:58

When you can retain your ability to be in wonder. In that space of wonder and enjoyment you can appreciate any Marvel movie, any DC, whatever any action kind of fantasy. Does that make sense? That's what bothers me about Martin Scorsese. If I knew him personally, I would go up to him and be like, first of all, stop talking ever about anyone else doing filmmaking not fair, shut up. And just because it's commercial and just because a lot of people like it, that you don't understand doesn't make it not worthy. You know, hey Tony, hey Tony, how you doing baby, Thank you.

Rick Costa: 43:43

That's what Disney does for Cynthia.

Carmen Lezeth: 43:47

Okay, we're gonna give you a moment to breathe. We're gonna give you a moment to breathe.

Rick Costa: 43:50

He looks like he's pent up with stuff to say.

Carmen Lezeth: 43:52

Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait. I'm gonna get some more water because I'm stuttering a lot, whatever. So you guys give me just a minute, just a minute. I can hear you, though, I can hear you.

Rick Costa: 44:01

All right, cool. All right, tony go.

Tony D. : 44:05

How do you not know? The age of Ultron was the one with Vision came in.

Rick Costa: 44:09

No, I couldn't think of the name, the title of the movie. I know the movie. I just couldn't think of the title of the movie Gotcha.

Tony D. : 44:15

And the other movie. Nothing to get Cynthia, but it was how to get away with murder. She put it in the movie. I was like, okay, y'all sit here, listen Close enough. We know you, man, I'm sitting here trying to drive and keep my eyes open. I'm like what they say yeah, it was a great show. It was controversial. Oh yeah, she's really gonna leave us in charge while she's not here. That shows you she trusts us. Someone love me, dude, no one love me. No one love me. I'm a same one.

Rick Costa: 44:42

I'm saying I'm a same one, my goose.

Tony D. : 44:44

The down to a major situation bothers me. I think the timing was off based on what happened. I didn't even get the whole story as well. Listen to me. What's going on, how you doing. I didn't like it. I hate that. I mean he was just starting to really get a presence in the Marvel Universe. In my opinion, he was actually about to be an absolute major character. So to me, a lot of this coming out, the timing's off, but I don't know when the situation happened as well. Yeah, I really don't.

Tony D. : 45:14

The Taraji P Henson I saw the clip. I'm not surprised, but it's anything I do want to throw out there that that just goes to show that the people who are making more money than us are still being taxed and economically taken advantage of as much as the rest of us. Most of us are only living off a 30% of our income anyway. The most of us are the way you do your numbers, the way you use your numbers. If she didn't have the staff, she would have more money, but she needs a staff for what she does, and that's just my take on what's going on. All I caught was when you all were talking about Jonathan Mejiz and Taraji P Henson, because I was out trying to get something to eat and I was going to watch the game for a minute.

Carmen Lezeth: 45:54

You can go. You can go, you don't have to. I appreciate you coming on. You didn't have to break up your night.

Tony D. : 46:00

I appreciate you. I wasn't you break it up, you break it up. The game is they're losing.

Carmen Lezeth: 46:05

Is that why you're here?

Tony D. : 46:06

No, I was just drinking and tripping out with folks and then I was like, ok, let me go and take myself home, because I don't want to go out and drink and get pulled over, and the cops was out, so I said let me take my money home. I'm actually glad you did do this, because I was going to get back around now anyway, get ready for Ted's show. So this just made me come home earlier and drink less. Good job.

Carmen Lezeth: 46:25

You coming out next week, though we're going to have you on next week and we're going to have a whole conversation about. Christmas and whatever, but go ahead Tell me what you think about Jonathan Mejiz, because I didn't hear that part. Did you already talk about Jonathan Mejiz? Yeah?

Tony D. : 46:36

I told him I think the time moves off. I don't know what the situation happened, but all this is starting to happen right as he's starting to blow up, because he's about to be a real major character in the Marvel Universe Real major, huge and I'm intended major, major Right, right, right. Good job. I don't know if anybody saw that season of Loki. He was phenomenal.

Carmen Lezeth: 46:57

Can I just say that whole, that whole, that was one of my favorites, the whole Loki, this last episode, this whole series was amazing. Loki was great.

Tony D. : 47:06

Jonathan Mejiz was phenomenal.

Carmen Lezeth: 47:08

He was amazing, amazing.

Tony D. : 47:10

He was phenomenal on that. So this to me it seems like when you're about to rise, they find a way to bring you back to reality for some reason. That's just what it looks like to me. I don't know the whole story and what's going on. I don't like it. He did creed, he did do a couple of kinks, he's been doing good with movies and things are starting to come up with the project that he's done. I just don't like what's happening and I don't know if anybody's seeing this or not, but they're taking out a lot of celebrities.

Carmen Lezeth: 47:35

What do you mean taking out? What do you mean taking out?

Tony D. : 47:37

You can take the situations happening with him and the accusations against him. You can take the situations happening with Diddy and the accusations against him. You can take a situation with R Kelly and the accusations against him. A lot of the major celebrities.

Carmen Lezeth: 47:45

OK, wait, let's not conflate P Diddy, r Kelly Johnathan and Major.

Tony D. : 47:53

A lot of celebrities, major celebrities. For some reason, things are just getting.

Carmen Lezeth: 47:57

OK, I don't want to do that. I don't want to conflate. Those are three different things and those other two I am not even putting in the same. I have much more compassion for Jonathan Major's in this situation than I do for Diddy.

Tony D. : 48:13

You may know more than I do, that's fine.

Carmen Lezeth: 48:15

I don't know nothing. I'm not with the lawyers and doing investigations. I'm just saying Jonathan Major's thing. I can at least, with the information we do have, we can see that Rick might be on to something. And yet I'm still going to believe the jury because I want to believe in our system of government, because we have to start finding a way to believe in something that's important to this country. But the other two Diddy's has been having a reputation, that's a whole other conversation you know what I mean.

Carmen Lezeth: 48:53

I don't want to conflate those two. Is that fair, Rick? Do you think that's fair? I think that's fair.

Rick Costa: 48:57

Oh, yeah, yeah. And honestly, musicians versus actors, it's a whole different thing somehow.

Carmen Lezeth: 49:03

Well, that's a good point. I didn't think about that because I always think celebrities, but you're right, that's a really good point.

Rick Costa: 49:08

I mean an actor can get a big head, but it's different with a musician, for some. When a musician really blows up, they really get a big head. I don't know why, but but you know what I'm going to totally end the show so that Tony can go do his thing.

Carmen Lezeth: 49:22

Bye everyone and remember it's always all about the joy. Merry Christmas to everyone who celebrates. Merry Christmas Happy holidays and enjoy the weekend. Bye, Thanks for stopping by. All about the joy Be better and stay beautiful folks. Have a sweet day.