All About The Joy
All About The Joy is a weekly hang-out with friends in the neighborhood! We share insight, advice, funny-isms and we choose to always try and find the positive, the silver lining, the "light" in all of it. AATJ comes from the simple concept that at the end of the day we all want to have more JOY than not. So, this is a cool place to unwind, have a laugh and share some time with friends!
All About The Joy
Hybrid Homeschooling: A New Blueprint for Real Learning
What if the best education for your child isn’t a yes-or-no choice between homeschooling and traditional school? We sit down with education reform advocate and author Chris Linder to explore a flexible path that blends the strengths of both. The idea is simple and powerful: keep the structure and social energy of the classroom, then add focused, at-home learning to close the gaps - critical thinking, financial literacy, study skills, and culturally relevant history.
Chris shares a personal journey from radio broadcasting to teaching in South Korea to instructional technology, and how a pandemic-era algebra struggle revealed the promise of hybrid homeschooling. One child thrived online, another needed a classroom. The solution wasn’t more pressure; it was targeted support. With the right curriculum and steady guidance, confidence rose and grades followed. That’s the blueprint: parents don’t have to reteach every subject; they guide, question, and curate resources that help kids make sense of the world.
We unpack what schools do well and where they fall short, how to use open-ended questions to build real comprehension, and why culture-rich materials strengthen engagement and identity. Chris explains how families can choose flexible curricula, verify sources (even when using AI), and join a supportive community like the Seat Squad to find low-cost, high-impact tools. Along the way, we honor teachers doing hard work with limited resources and offer a model that makes them allies, not adversaries.
The outcome is bigger than grades. It’s giving kids real choices after graduation - college, trades, entrepreneurship - because they can reason, adapt, and see themselves in the story of their learning. Ready to take back agency without burning out? Tap play, share this with a parent who needs it, and subscribe for more conversations that put families at the center of education. If this resonated, leave a review and tell us the one skill you wish schools taught more.
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Music By Geovane Bruno, Moments, 3481
Editing by Team A-J
Host, Carmen Lezeth
DISCLAIMER: As always, please do your own research and understand that the opinions in this podcast and livestream are meant for entertainment purposes only. States and other areas may have different rules and regulations governing certain aspects discussed in this podcast. Nothing in our podcast or livestream is meant to be medical or legal advice. Please use common sense, and when in doubt, ask a professional for advice, assistance, help and guidance.
Hey everyone, welcome to All About the Joy. This is the private lounge, and my guest today is Chris Linder. Did I say your last name right? Because I always missed it. Okay. First, I want to say thank you so much for coming on the show. I appreciate it.
Chris Linder:Oh, thanks for having me.
Carmen Lezeth:Um, so I'm gonna just do a little background bio on you, and then I'm gonna get into some questions if that's okay. Uh, you tell me if I'm wrong, but um, you are an education reform advocate and the author of Homeschool Remix. Um, that's a guide that blends traditional classroom structure with the flexibility of homeschooling. Okay. You champion a hybrid strategy that empowers parents, especially in marginalized communities, to reclaim control over children's education.
Chris Linder:Correct.
Carmen Lezeth:That's the gist.
Chris Linder:Yes, yeah, that's it.
Carmen Lezeth:Okay, and then I read on your website, which I want to share with people your mission statement, because I thought that was even more uh succinct. I don't even know if that's the right word, but we're gonna go with it. Um your mission is to empower parents with the tools and strategies needed to create a dynamic learning environment that combines the flexibility of homeschooling with the structure and socialization of traditional classrooms. So, my first question is how did this start for you and why are you doing it?
Chris Linder:All right. Well, yeah, that's a good question. Um kind of a long story. I'll keep it as brief as possible. I started out um elementary school for me was uh a small charter school in Wisconsin. We worked at our own pace in little cubicles. Um I didn't see the inside of a traditional classroom until middle school and high school. Uh so for me, education has always been uh a really self-directed, self-guided personal thing. Um, independent learning has always been what I've what I've been doing. Um my high school had a radio station, so I got into radio broadcasting.
Carmen Lezeth:Um I can hear the voice. That makes sense. That makes sense.
Chris Linder:And it's a little it's a little hoarse now, but you know, it's all good.
Carmen Lezeth:It sounds great. Yeah.
Chris Linder:Um, but I I was lucky enough to have great teachers in high school and in college. She taught me the importance of critical thinking, the importance of being able to write, to express myself, and to read. Um I I loved literature and so on. I was on the air in Knoxville, Tennessee, and I was bored. I I want I had this wanderlust in my system. And I was like, Okay. What can I do that will help me see the world, still make some money, and then come back and I can do radio for the rest of my life and and and just be settled down. Okay. So I got a book called Work Your Way Around the World, and it said uh you can uh go to Europe and you know, or South America, and you can work in the fields, you can pick fruits when it's time to harvest and so on, and or you could go to Asia and you could teach English. And I was like, I'm not a farmer, I'm not I'm not an outside person. So let me let me see this teaching thing. So I went to South Korea and I started Oh wow, yeah, I started teaching English in a language institute called uh Hagwan. Um and wait, did you know Korean? No, not at all.
Carmen Lezeth:That's fantastic. Okay, go ahead. I'm sorry.
Chris Linder:I had like $400 saved up from working radio. I bought a ticket. I I got to Korea and I was like, here I am. Um didn't I I I learned a little bit of Korean on the plane on the way over there. I got one of those uh you know lonely planet guidebooks.
Carmen Lezeth:Um, this is while you're in college or right after college?
Chris Linder:This is after college. I'm just right after college for a couple of years after college, and you know, you don't make a lot of money in radio, but I was doing all right. And I was like, let me go ahead and get this wanderlust out of my system and and do whatever I can. Um, and so yeah, I did. I wow uh I taught in Korea for two years um at a Hagwan. Uh I taught college students, uh, some high schoolers, some older businessmen. And for the most part, my students were taking regular college classes during the day, and then they come to our Hagwan either before their classes or after, like late at night. I learned that students, even the high schoolers, um, would do this extra language learning um because they knew in the future that it would help them, you know, with the learn English. And also they love learning English because of the American movies that were prevalent.
Carmen Lezeth:So, you know, they wanted to learn our slang and idioms and I wish we in the United States would want to learn other languages, you know what I mean? But that's a whole other conversation.
Chris Linder:Yeah, yeah. And that's it's it's something like you know, a lot of uh there's a lot of differences between students in the rest of the world and students in America. And that's one of those things that you know, if we'd you know open up our open up our minds and and let down the borders and just kind of you know look at other cultures and be curious about um other cultures, we'd want to learn their language, we'd want to learn how you know how they conduct their lives. And that that would be awesome. That would be wonderful. But uh yeah.
Carmen Lezeth:So so you're in South Korea, you're teaching English, you're there for two years. Is your wonderlust done? Clearly not.
Chris Linder:Well, kind of. It was it was kind of the cure for that wanderlust wanderlust when um we had. Um, there was, you know, not really recession. This is before the the tech bubble burst, but there was kind of a a ripple, and in the rest of the world, the dollar began to um really lose value. So I was making less and less money every day. So I decided to come back, uh come back to the States, and also I was kind of homesick for certain things in America. So I decided, okay, all right, my time is done here, came back to America, and uh I got back into radio, but then always had that teaching thing in the back of my mind. So I was substitute teaching on the side. I met my my wife, who was an elementary school teacher. Oh, okay. And she kind of got me like to see that, well, you're not really gonna make a lot of money in radio. Maybe you should consider teaching as a fallback. Um, so I got uh a degree in instructional technology and started teaching high school world literature.
Carmen Lezeth:Wow, okay.
Chris Linder:And my wife went on and and wrote books on uh on the common core and on uh using anchor charts in the classroom. Um and we started doing professional development around the country for for teachers. Okay, um, and then my my wife passed away.
Carmen Lezeth:Oh I'm so sorry.
Chris Linder:Okay, so I wasn't aware of that. No, yeah, in 2016. We had two kids, so they weren't homeschooled. The homeschooling thing is something that that comes on a little bit later um because it actually comes on after COVID. Wow, okay. Like we were lucky enough to have you know great schools and everything. And when I had brought up the idea of homeschooling, my wife at the my wife was like, no, you know, because there's this stigma around homeschooling that homeschool kids aren't socialized, they'll turn out weird or what have you. And she was an elementary teacher, so she was like that's number 18 on my list.
Carmen Lezeth:But go ahead. We're gonna get there, but okay, so you're already answering it. So there was a stigma, and your wife was like, No, we're not homeschooled.
Chris Linder:Yeah, she was she was against it. And I was like, okay, well, you know, because you know, she's in charge. So um, but after COVID, when uh when we had to do remote learning, um I had one child who was thriving with remote learning, and my other child wasn't as uh comfortable with it, they really needed a uh a classroom environment. What I was realizing was that uh even after COVID, um when my youngest child would have trouble with uh, for example, algebra. I talk about this in the book when when they were having trouble with algebra, I was like, okay, well, I can help with that. Right, you know, not realizing that algebra, algebra hasn't changed, but I guess my level of math has changed over the past few decades. I was like, wow, this is this is pretty advanced. This is like you know, I'm used to okay, X plus Y. I get that.
Carmen Lezeth:Exactly, but then they go all out, yeah.
Chris Linder:Right, right. So um, so I was like, okay, I gotta figure out because in the classroom, if you're not keeping up with the with the rest of the class, the teacher can only do so much. Yes. And if you fail, you just fail, and you know, you have to get put down a class or whatever next semester. And I was like, okay, well, we're not gonna fail. So I gotta figure out what I can do to supplement the education that they're getting in school with some home learning or something. I found uh some homeschooling curricula that would help with algebra, and I sat with my child and we worked on it together, and you know, long story short, they passed algebra, and I was like, oh, you know, this is laughing because I cause because it sounds torturous when you said I sat with my child and went through algebra.
Carmen Lezeth:Oh my, ooh, okay, but they passed.
Chris Linder:But it wasn't, yeah, and it wasn't that bad. And I didn't have to I didn't have to learn algebra. That was the that was the the point. The great part of it was I didn't have to actually learn it to teach it. Right. Um, I just had to guide them through it, which I I was okay with, you know. Right. And I realized that, okay, well, if I can figure out um what curricula, what curriculum to use with supplementing this, then other parents were probably looking for that kind of thing too, and maybe, you know, maybe they need help with that. Um, and then the more I looked at what my my kids were studying in school, the more I realized that they're learning less and less of the important stuff.
Carmen Lezeth:And what say that again? Wait, wait, wait. So say that again because I misunderstood something.
Chris Linder:The more I looked at what they were learning in school, the more I realized that they were learning less and less of the important stuff. They weren't getting practical life skills. My daughter, I was taking her to, she was a senior in high school, I was taking her to work, and she asked me, Dad, what's a mortgage? And I was like, to me, that's like the you know, the simplest thing. But it's like, well, why aren't you, you know, you're not you're about to graduate high school and you don't know what a mortgage is. Right. We we have we're raising kids, and here I go on my soapbox again, but we're raising kids who are better equipped to handle an active shooter than they are to balance a checkbook or to apply for a mortgage. Um, we're not teaching financial literacy in school, we're not teaching you know practical life skills, and and now we're not even teaching like black history or brown history, cultural history. Well, not teaching, you know, fundamental things.
Carmen Lezeth:We're not teaching American history, which is black history.
Chris Linder:There you go. There you go.
Carmen Lezeth:We're not teaching anything that has anything to do with, yeah, don't get me on my soapbox. I'm gonna let you keep going.
Chris Linder:It's being redefined.
Carmen Lezeth:It's being redefined, right, right.
Chris Linder:You know, you add that to the books that are that are being banned. My my my youngest brought home a box of books from the library, from the school library, because they were like they're being banned. Yeah, they were just gonna throw these out. Um, it's it wasn't because they were banned, but because they might be banned in the future, right?
Carmen Lezeth:You know, that's a shame. You know, I wanted to share something with you because you said something that was interesting about basic skills. I'm not even talking about mortgage and balancing a checkbook and just emotional intelligence, you know, like we're not learning any of those things. But even in my own experience, so you should know, you should you don't know this, but I'm gonna share this with you. Most of my audience knows this. I don't have children. Um, and I consider that the blessing every day. I have, I love kids. I have way too many godchildren and um nieces and nephews. And I feel like that's that's what I'm the good auntie. That's what I am. But I think it's important because as the outsider looking at the struggles that I see parents go through, um, when it comes to education, is that's why I wanted to interview. That's why I wanted to talk to you, because I think this hybrid idea is profound. In my own experience, the way that I grew up, um, you know, I didn't have parents. And so I ended up getting through school. And I went to Catholic school, Catholic school. And I do this because it was, it's supposed to be better than the other schools, and it's not. All we learned was really religion, some grammar and English, and some math. We had some good lay teachers, but at the end of the day, when I got to college, which I did end up going to college, not because of high school, not because of the schools I went to, but because other people intervened and made sure I went, I found out that I didn't have the basic fundamental. I can't believe I'm admitting this, but I'm gonna, I didn't have the basic fundamental learning skills in order to succeed. And the first semester I was at college and I was studying all the time and I was trying so hard and I was failing every test. I was, and I and I was lucky because I knew people in the administration. I was, I was very lucky, and they got me tested because they thought maybe I had a learning disability. But I didn't have a learning disability. What I didn't have was basic skills. I got through the first 12 years in school without anyone noticing, and I went to, and that's why I did the quotes earlier, without anyone noticing that I didn't have the basic schools to make it through my freshman year in college. And so I bring that to you because I am I don't know, I might have to cut this all out. I'm a little embarrassed now, but no, no. What you're talking about, this hybrid situation. How do you think it would have helped someone like myself, or how do you see it helping? I think on your website you said marginalized. I'm just gonna say poor. Uh also poor uh students. How does this help them?
Chris Linder:I would say it's not necessarily poor students. When I say marginalized, I mean students from black, brown, indigenous families, uh students who may be LGBTQ, students who are neurodivergent, students who are not, you know, don't fit in neatly to that that round hole that education is trying to jam these square pegs in.
Carmen Lezeth:Okay.
Chris Linder:So all of those all of those kids um who are not, you know, your your typical Dick and Jane mainstream kids. Okay, that's families, and and that's that's actually the majority of families, the majority of families. And it's because the educational system is is designed to really it's really designed to not um to not train and produce the best and the brightest. It's designed to produce a workforce that knows how to follow directions and may read at a fifth or sixth sixth grade reading level, um, doesn't have critical thinking skills because that's not necessary to have uh a labor job.
Carmen Lezeth:Um is that factual what you're saying?
Chris Linder:It's factual and it's it's been the case for 125 years. That's why the education system hasn't really changed.
Carmen Lezeth:But isn't that sad that that's what we're training?
Chris Linder:It's it's sad unless you're uh a member of the oligarchy and you're wondering, well, where am I gonna get you know uh more people to work? Labor force. Where am I gonna get uh bodies to fill my factories or my farms um so that you know I think an entrepreneur can make a lot of money.
Carmen Lezeth:Okay, but then why oh then that's why we make it so hard for people to go to college. That's why we make uh I just I just had a light bulb moment.
Chris Linder:Yeah, and that and that's the truth. And you know, once in a while, I mean, you know, statistic statistics are that, you know, once in a while a few will slip through the cracks and accidentally thrive, accidentally go to college. But even that is becoming harder and harder now. It's much harder to pay for college, it's becoming harder to get into college.
Carmen Lezeth:No, absolutely. And that's why I started, and I said I I was one of the lucky ones because I actually got the help I needed immediately and was able to work with the professors that were like like here's some simple things. Like I couldn't take timed tests. So if you if you said to me, Carmen, I want you to answer every question in front of me in front of the class, I was game, I could do it. But for some reason, there was that thing where it was timed, I froze, I couldn't remember. I so all of these little things. And I keep thinking, like when I was reading up on you, the ability to have had a one-on-one with a parent or an adult, or I mean, why don't you tell me more about what your program does before I start telling you what I wished I had?
Chris Linder:Sure. You know? Um, I guess the big thing is we're not trying to change education, the educational system from the inside out. Um my mission is to let parents know that while the system may not be working as well as it should be, ultimately the responsibility and the power to make a positive change for your young person is in your hands as the parent. Um, and what hybrid homeschooling is, um let me let me back up. What full-time homeschooling is, is saying, okay, I'm gonna withdraw my student from school and I'm gonna take on the burden of teaching them each and every subject at home. And that actually works for a lot of people. It doesn't work for a lot of people from marginalized communities, and I'm not, and again, it's not just poor communities, but like I know I'm I'm struggling with it just because I'm like everyone you just mentioned is poor.
Carmen Lezeth:But I I get it because because are okay, I understand when when when you say marginalized communities, I guess I'm trying not to use the buzzwords that turn people off because people don't like to hear minority, marginalized, right? That that's especially no offense to my audience. Yeah, my audience tends to not be this group, so that's part of it. But the but aren't most marginalized people that we're talking about people that don't have tons of money? They might not be poor, they'll be maybe middle class, but they don't have the kind of money to have.
Chris Linder:It's you know, single parents, yes, they don't have time to to to full-time homeschool their kids. Even dual income parents, if they're both at work, they don't have time for full-time homeschooling.
Carmen Lezeth:But but nobody's saying that full-time homeschooling is better than traditional school, right? That's not what you're saying.
Chris Linder:It's it's six of one, half a dozen of the other. I mean, both in both cases, there's a lot, there's a lot wrong with the traditional educational system, but there's a lot right with it too. Um, and with homeschooling, uh, it's great for a lot of people. Uh, for some people, their their kids still isn't gonna get, you know, they're there are certain things that they're not going to figure out. Teaching is hard. And we learned this during COVID. The professional teachers who went to school to learn the science of teaching, you know, they're actually doing a great job with what they're given. But they're given on a daily basis, they're given, they're given 125 students, you know, 20 or 25 at a time, all with different personalities, all going through puberty, you know, all having their own issues, their own trauma that they're dealing with.
Carmen Lezeth:Yeah, the ratio is just wrong. It's always been wrong. Even when I was in school, the ratio of teacher to students was too much. It always has been.
Chris Linder:Yes, and they're just, you know, and it's just getting worse as they, you know, reduce funding to schools or bring in things like uh school choice or voucher programs, um, diverting tax money away from public schools, putting them into private schools, which can afford to be exclusionary. Um, they can, you know, decide whether or not your kid fits their profile and should be admitted to their school and so on. But um, but no. Uh with parents, what they need to realize is um homeschooling, full-time homeschooling isn't for everybody.
Carmen Lezeth:Right.
Chris Linder:But traditional school and just leaving it up to the state to educate your student in everything that they need to know, that's not for anybody. Because there will be things that your student isn't going to, your child isn't gonna learn in school. Right. You know, and it, you know, all you can do is try to identify those things and teach them at home with targeted home learning. And that's what hybrid home learning is.
Carmen Lezeth:This is what you do.
Chris Linder:And so it's all about.
Carmen Lezeth:So why don't we talk about what would be first of all, if people want to find out more about what you do, what is the website again?
Chris Linder:It's homeschoolremix.com.
Carmen Lezeth:Homeschoolremix.com, and I'll make sure to put that down at the bottom, but also for the audio, I just want people to hear it as well. What would be the first thing someone should do if they want to find out more about what you offer?
Chris Linder:Look around on the site. Um, we are in the process of building a community called the Seat Squad, which is all about support, educate, adapt, and thrive. It's all about bringing together um families who are either just beginning in homeschooling or in homeschool veterans, uh, bringing them together with counselors and educators, and just building community through through homeschooling. Because the one the number one reason people don't really homeschool is because if they get started, they're worried that they won't be able to have any support whatsoever.
Carmen Lezeth:Um but you're not advocating just for homeschooling, you're saying, so you know what, can you tell me more about what a day in the light of your program would be? Maybe we should go there. So I understand it better.
Chris Linder:Okay, so so hybrid homeschooling or homeschool remix, this framework is basically giving a parent, putting it back into their hands, the control of education, saying that you know what, leave your kids in school. You can leave them enrolled either full-time or in some states they allow you to allow you to do it two or three days a week, and then figure out what they're not getting in school, teach that to them either, you know, an hour a day or a few hours a week. And that way you're not devoting all of your time to homeschooling. Um, you're bridging the gap, you're filling in what they're not getting in school with home lessons.
Carmen Lezeth:I feel like what you might be talking about is getting parents back involved with also not just dropping off their kids in school, leaving it to the schools to try to teach them everything, and then expect them to come out perfect and ready for college or whatever it is their trade school or whatever it is they're going to be doing.
Chris Linder:That's exactly what I'm saying. That's exactly what I'm saying. Like taking the responsibility of educating your kids and helping them to thrive, taking that on, partnering with your teachers, partnering with your your school district, your school system, and saying, hey, you know, it's not it's not parents versus teachers. It's not who's gonna be the better teacher, it's how can we both cooperate so that our student can turn out the best.
Carmen Lezeth:And not fall through the cracks and not end up in a situation, I mean, look it, I'm completely, absolutely blessed. I've had a perfect, wonderful life, right? I don't mean to make it sound. But when I think about the struggles that I went through, and if it wasn't for all the right people who stepped in, I would have fallen through the cracks because they didn't have those basics. And so what you're talking about is that if a parent is involved in their child's education and understands what they don't know, what their children are not learning, whether it's what is a mortgage, whether it's not understanding reading and comprehension or algebra, when you can see what your child is doing and not doing, you can give them a much better, stronger education so that they actually succeed.
Chris Linder:Exactly. Exactly. And that's and that's really the whole point. And the secret of it is you have to, as a parent, you have to model how to learn. You have to let them know that you know what, I don't know everything, but we can figure it out. I can, you know, read, I can research, I can ask questions. If you can model that for your child, they'll be fine. If you can incorporate critical thinking into everything that they do, whether it's schoolwork or or home lessons.
Carmen Lezeth:So I'm gonna I'm gonna ask you a question because I think we use these words and people don't know what it really means. What does critical thinking mean? Like, what do you mean by that? Can you give us an example?
Chris Linder:Sure. Um critical thinking is really what it looks like is you asking open-ended questions as a as a learner, as a person who is going through life, you need to ask questions like, why is this important? Why is this happening? What is the reason for this? And then, you know, letting those questions, instead of just taking something at face value and going, well, I guess that's the way things should be.
Carmen Lezeth:And and and it's kind of the because I learned what critical thinking was when I was in college. And that's way too late. But that's when I started, it's not too late. It's never too late to learn. But you can you can help your children so much better if you could take some of this information that we're sharing here. Um, here's the thing is critical thinking is also the difference between memorizing and actually understanding something. That's what it is for me.
Chris Linder:Yeah.
Carmen Lezeth:When you actually understand something, you are curious. You keep asking more questions. You go down that rabbit hole because you really want to fully understand it. And some of the things that I was doing, um, and I'm using myself as an example, not because I want to keep sharing every single personal thing about myself as we do my shows, but it seems to be part of what happens, is because I want people to people have an idea that everybody has this life. That they have and it was so easy, or it was like whatever, everybody has a struggle.
unknown:Sure.
Chris Linder:And when I love the fact that you're making the connections because that's what that's what critical thinking is.
Carmen Lezeth:Yes.
Chris Linder:You know, being able to, you know, here's a fact. And then you making making a connection to your life. That's what it that's what it's all about. So yes, please.
Carmen Lezeth:Well, because I want people to relate to it too. I think people need to understand that everything isn't magical. But if you're just memorizing things, if you're just hearing somebody else say it and then you're regurgitating it, you're just repeating it. Hmm, we can talk about that on another level, but and you're not fully understanding it in all the layers, you're not being a critical thinker.
Chris Linder:That's fair enough. And unfortunately, that's an epidemic that uh that all you have to do is look at the news and you know where that gets us if we're not critical thinking. If we're just listening to uh sound bites and bumper stickers, you know, we're not going to think about when someone tells us what they consider to be a fact. We're not going to or alternative facts.
Carmen Lezeth:Please don't feel hesitant unless it's up to you. You don't have to feel hesitant about getting into politics at all because this is your interview. I'm just saying. Um, because I know where you're going with this. I mean, for me, and and we do have an you can't help but go with go there, you know? Yeah, you can't help it. I mean, that's part of the other reason why I wanted you on the show is like it's so important to be an educated human being. And if we can understand that children need that at the beginning, and how can you figure out different ways? I feel like a lot of parents use, and and again, as an observer, an observer, use school as a babysitting place. They don't understand the value of getting a good education. You're gonna find out later on if you don't take. I'm sorry to be so mean about it because I know you seem nicer about it, but I feel very adamant that I see so many kids falling through the cracks because their parents are not involved at all. There's no adult involved in their schooling.
Chris Linder:Yeah, it's it's a shame. It's just it's sad. But yeah, that's that's exactly right. Parents need to really, I mean, it's easy for us to sit here and say, oh, parents need to learn to do this, parents need to do that. But when you're working a full-time job as a parent, the last thing you want to do is say, wait, you mean I can't I can't just leave my kid at school and and trust that they'll learn. I have to do it myself. I have to do that myself too. And it's it's tough, it's hard.
Carmen Lezeth:I look at, and I have very I have zero sympathy because I am the meanest person. Here's the thing: I made a choice not to have children. There are pros and cons of that. You made a choice to have children, there are pros and cons of that, but there are responsibilities as well. Yeah, and I only say it because of my situation, the way I grew up, and and I am gonna keep bringing it back to that is I I could have easily fallen through the cracks and I didn't. But there are so many other people who had a worse beginning in their lives than I did, right? Even though we all have our story, but they didn't get the luxury that I got that people were there to just make sure I walked on through no matter what.
Chris Linder:Right.
Carmen Lezeth:It shouldn't be a chance, it shouldn't be that we all need to do our part to take care of the children around us. And I think that's the other part of it too. Like, this is me doing my part for all children.
unknown:Okay.
Carmen Lezeth:Like having Chris on the show is another thing I'm trying to do. Um, let me ask you this question. There are concerns like from um homeschooling advocates about your program. What do you say to them? I mean, you've kind of already touched on it a bit, but what's like the sound bite you want to give to people who are saying no, no?
Chris Linder:People who are people who are against homeschooling or people who are for traditional homeschooling.
Carmen Lezeth:So yeah, so I have two questions, but I guess we've already talked about let me let me let me start over. How do you answer critiques from traditional homeschoolers? They say it's too structured. There's um some feel hybrid models mimic private school too closely, or curriculum control and some hybrid setups, the program, not the parent, chooses the curriculum and the assignments, which can feel restrictive.
unknown:Sure.
Carmen Lezeth:That's a better way to ask that question. I apologize.
Chris Linder:No, no, and I I totally understand what uh what I've done with my framework is made it so that you you're not locked into a specific program's curriculum. I think the flexibility and freedom of curriculum is really key, especially for, and I know we we keep saying this, especially for marginalized communities, um, for black students, brown students, and so on, who need to see themselves reflected in the subjects and topics, things that they study. Um, they're not gonna get that in your standard textbooks off the shelves. Um so you have to be creative as a parent to actually just you know look for and adapt lesson plans and curriculum that that reflect you and your culture, your own culture, as well as a diverse uh overarching culture that you're able to give more of a perspective on. So I push back on anybody who's saying that uh a hybrid homeschooling is restrictive as far as curriculum or restrictive as far as structure. Uh the structure comes from the traditional school. You as a parent um use that for structure, but you also are flexible enough to do whatever fits your unique needs in your family, you know, for that for that homeschool part.
Carmen Lezeth:Can you give an example of how culturally like how culturally significant you might infuse something in a subject that your child might need that would not be in a traditional, I don't know, whether it's algebra or history. I mean, history would probably be the easiest one, right? So you would use a history book and they would be talking about, let's say, the Confederacy or something, right? Or they'd be talking just about civil rights or whatever it is, sure. And you would give the other lens, but where would you get that information if you're not fully? I mean, anyways, you see what I'm trying to get at. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Because here's the thing. I want you to explain it to white folk. I'm gonna say it is my show. You see what I'm saying? Because they hear the buzzwords and what do you mean? What do you mean? So, what do you mean when you say that?
Chris Linder:Luckily, we have the universe at our fingertips now with computers. Um, even and I know that this is a very divisive word, AI. Um, I love it. There's no reason, right? There's no reason for you not to be able to have information about whatever subject you're teaching, or whatever subject your student needs to get this help in. If you're uh obviously with history, um and be before I go any further, if you're going to use AI to devise lesson plans and and so on, double triple check your sources. AI is notorious for hallucinating, and you know, it's basically crowd-funded, you know, okay.
Carmen Lezeth:But does homeschool remix and the community you have there would help with that? So let's say I was like, okay, I'm teaching my niece about history and I don't know enough about what happened, whatever. I don't know. Okay, I can go to your website and maybe what happens? I go to your website, I can contact someone. How does it work?
Chris Linder:Go to the website, you can you can get a copy of the book, Homeschool Remix, which basically outlines the framework. But yes, join the community, um, post in the community, ask questions, say you need help with it's a little bit uh it's similar to a Facebook group, but people there are are you know they've gone through it so they can help you with it. And I guarantee you, if you have this question, there's other people that are also wondering the same thing, and somebody has solved it with um history, for example. Um, one of the things that I like to uh suggest as a curriculum is um a book. It's actually a curriculum called Woke Homeschooling.
Carmen Lezeth:Okay, that's gonna turn off every single person listening. But you know what? No, it shouldn't. I love it. I love it because I always say this all the time. Like they're just abusing the word woke in all the wrong ways. Like, I would rather be woke than not woke because that means I'm sleeping. Like, anyways, go ahead. I'm sorry. We need to say that I'm like ding ding ding ding ding.
Chris Linder:I get that. That's one of those that's one of those words. But again, with the power of language, we can't let words that mean one thing be redefined as something opposite, and that's exactly what's being done. With and now they're they're demonizing DEI. Well, they've been doing that, right? Critical race theory, which is nothing nothing about what they describe it as. And they're trying to demonize woke.
Carmen Lezeth:And well, it goes back to being a critical thinker, right? It goes back to being someone who doesn't just look at the surface of things and actually digs deep and understands and I always say the nuance of things, you know. But it's so much easier to just have stuff thrown at you and just believing it because he said it or she said it than to actually go through it.
Chris Linder:And there's so much stuff being blasted at you on a daily basis from people of authority, which makes it worse. It's it's it's what he realized that as a Republican, what they need to do is just throw all these different things at you, and you don't have time to react. You don't have time to really think each thing through. And you know, you may be you know focusing on you know the the $200 million 90,000 square foot ballroom, and that will that will take your focus away from the fact that there's armed and masked men kidnapping American citizens off the street. That's right, you know, and and that's going to distract you from the Epstein files, right?
Carmen Lezeth:Which is really all we all want is the Epstein files right now at this moment. Because now he's made it. No, no, come on, because now I didn't care at all before all of this, but now that he's made it such a big deal, I want to see it.
Chris Linder:But let me go back to the All we really want is is someone to just take the the veil of ignorance off of the entire country, yeah, and so we can start singing brand new day, like at the end of the whiz.
Carmen Lezeth:I know, right?
Chris Linder:Oh, I would love to know the wicked witches, you know, Evelyn has gone into her big toilet.
Carmen Lezeth:No, I know, I know.
Chris Linder:That's what we really want. We want an end to this. Whether it happens in November of next year or two years later, or you know, I want an end to this now because I'm tired.
Carmen Lezeth:It's true. Yes. But but here's the thing while all this is happening, while people are, you know, being upset about words they don't understand because they're not using critical theory, like, you know, um I'm sorry, critical thinking, like DEI or woke or whatever, what's actually happening is your children are the ones who are losing out because they're not learning anything. They're not figuring it out, they're not getting the education that they need to get. And that that scares me. I also want to give a shout out to teachers because what I also love about you is um you have a lot of love for teachers, of course. Now I understand even more so why. Uh, but I do think at some point we need to have the conversation when we have sanity back. Teachers need to be not only paid well, but supported. Like, and I mean supported not just also financially, but I remember, and I don't remember much about my mom, but my mom at one point was helping, she was a teacher's aide, along with being a housekeeper. So she would go into the schools and act as an assistant to the classroom. And and the only reason why I would know is because Catholic school would have all these holidays, right? And I would have to go with her. So I we I either go with her when she was housekeeping or when she would go to the school. They don't have that anymore, right? They don't have the help that teachers need.
Chris Linder:They do have teachers' aids. Um, but again, because of the the the funding and budget cuts that are rampant, a lot of districts can't afford to to to hire as many teachers' aides as they as they would have in the past, right? So yeah.
Carmen Lezeth:Wow, it's been so great to have you on the show. We haven't even gotten through the second list of questions, but um, let me just ask you one last one. What's next for you? What do you see as kind of the legacy of this program, or what is the next steps for you and your organization?
Chris Linder:I've got to figure out, we have to figure out a way to make education go viral.
unknown:I love that.
Chris Linder:Trying to figure out how to change people's minds, parents' minds, families' minds, and again, it doesn't matter what color or anything like that. Just for them to realize that it's gonna take a while for us to A, figure all this, all this stuff out, and B, fix it after it's done, after that brand new day arrives, there's gonna be a lot of things to fix. But meanwhile, our students are getting older, our students are going to you know reach 12th grade and graduate. So we can't pause education. We can't you know hope hope that, well, maybe in the next five years we'll decide that the Department of Education is actually important. Well, maybe we shouldn't get rid of it. My goodness. You know, we have to take uh the the control of education back from the institutions and into the hands of families. Yeah. And and it has to be a it has to be a fundamental switch in people's heads that they realize it's education is way too important for my kid to go without it, and it's my responsibility to make sure they get it, and it's my responsibility to make sure that they're equipped when they graduate to go through with critical thinking, to be able to have choices after they graduate of what kind of job they want. Because, like I come down on you know, the educational system pouring out, putting out labor, you know, laborers as is that that's the goal of it. And there's nothing wrong with being a laborer, there's nothing wrong with working in a factory or in a field. Um do what you want to do, do what you like to do, but you should have a choice. Your your kids should have a choice as to what they want to be, and it shouldn't be that you know the administration or whomever decides that, well, because your student is fill in the blank, they're only good to be a laborer, or they're only good to have this kind of job or that kind of position, or you're talking about to get into college.
Carmen Lezeth:Yeah, yeah. You're you're talking about real wealth. I'm not talking about money wealth, you're talking about the wealth of choices, the ability to make a decision. I have one nephew who is deciding, along with his parents, not to go to college, but instead to go to trade school and learn to become an electrician because that's what he wants to do. And I thought it was so brilliant because he's thinking about the future and AI and what he really wants to be doing. And it's like, but he has a wealth of choices because his parents have been so involved in his education that the choice not to go to college and to go to trade school is wealth. That is a wealth of a choice to be able to make along with his parents. So and very smart, really smart, especially with AI, yeah.
Chris Linder:With the whole 10 years ago or 15 years ago, we wanted everybody to learn to be coders.
Carmen Lezeth:Yeah.
Chris Linder:You know, but but now it's like, well, yeah, maybe maybe actually working with your hands is a is a good choice.
Carmen Lezeth:Is a good choice, especially if that's what you like to do. But again, you're not gonna know that if you don't have and I I'm gonna say this one thing. I think the relationship between parent and children, like their children, is so important. And people think that just because they have children, they actually have that relationship. And part of what you're talking about is you have to care about your child's education. It's like and and I internalize that. Yes, yes, I'm a little envious of it. But I think that's what that's what I got from reading about you and learning about you was like we need to care more about what's happening with our children when it comes to education and not hoping that uh a teacher who is trying to take care of 75 children um is going to teach them everything, no matter how great that teacher is, you know.
Chris Linder:So it's not like it is in the movies.
Carmen Lezeth:No, not well, not at all. No, but um, but Chris, thank you so much for being here. I appreciate it. I hope you'll come back and maybe we can have you come back with uh the rest of the crew if you'd like to do that. Um we could talk a little bit more and see. They all have children, so I kind of like that I had this special time with you because we could have this conversation. Um, but that might be something if you were willing to do it.
Chris Linder:You know, I'm totally willing. Yes, yes, let's do it.
Carmen Lezeth:So, everyone, um, remember it's Chris Linder. The name of the website is homeschoolremix.com. What's the name of the book?
Chris Linder:Uh, the book's called Homeschool Remix.
Carmen Lezeth:You can find it on the website. Oh, and what else? I'm sorry. Yes. Oh, I'm gonna start saying that more often actually to support your local bookstores because that's true. We really do need to. Um, what else were you gonna say?
Chris Linder:Uh our community is called the seat squad, and it's it's called that because we practice folding chair homeschooling, which is basically finding free and low-cost um resources to to use while hybrid homeschooling. Um, and it comes from the Shirley Chisholm quote if they don't find if they don't have a seat for you at the table, bring a folding chair. Yeah, bring a folding chair.
Carmen Lezeth:Oh, that's great. I was trying to figure out how the folding chair came in. Got it. That's great.
Chris Linder:There's a bunch of ways for you to spend a whole lot of money homeschooling, but if you're smart about it, there's no reason why you have to spend a lot of money. A lot of money. Yeah.
Carmen Lezeth:Check out the website, get in touch with Chris, and um, yeah, thank you, everyone. Chris, thank you so much. And remember, at the end of the day, it really is all about the joy. Thank you, everyone. Bye. Thanks for stopping by, All About the Joy. Be better and stay beautiful, folks. Have a sweet day.
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