What’s Really Going On With China, Taiwan, and White America

In this episode of Culture and Consequence, Carmen and Andrea dive into the messy, confusing, and often misunderstood politics of China and Taiwan — breaking it down in plain language for anyone who’s ever wondered what the drama is really about. From the history of the Chinese Civil War to Taiwan’s global power as the world’s leading chip manufacturer, Carmen lays out the basics with her signature clarity and humor.

From there, the conversation shifts into the Voting Rights Act, the Supreme Court’s latest gutting of Section 2, and the uncomfortable truth about race, power, and fear in America. Carmen and Andrea talk openly about white supremacy, political gerrymandering, and why so many people still refuse to confront the country’s history — and its present.

It’s honest, fiery, funny, and painfully real. If you’re trying to make sense of the world right now, this episode is for you.

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As always, remember it really is All About The Joy.

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Music By Geovane Bruno, Moments, 3481
Editing by Team A-J
Host, Carmen Lezeth


DISCLAIMER:  As always, please do your own research and understand that the opinions in this podcast and livestream are meant for entertainment purposes only. States and other areas may have different rules and regulations governing certain aspects discussed in this podcast.  Nothing in our podcast or livestream is meant to be medical or legal advice. Please use common sense, and when in doubt, ask a professional for advice, assistance, help and guidance. 

Transcript

[00:16:00] Carmen: how are you?

[00:16:01] Andrea: I am good. How are you? You look fabulous.

[00:16:05] Carmen: Do I really?

[00:16:06] Andrea: do. Got that glow,

[00:16:09] Carmen: Yeah, 

[00:16:09] Andrea: got that cleavage. You're just ready.

[00:16:13] Carmen: makeup. Um, yeah, like...

[00:16:15] Andrea: I love when people are like, "You look so good." I'm like, "Yeah, I washed my hair."

[00:16:19] Carmen: Exactly, like, um, I, I, I put a little of... What's that, um, I don't wanna promote it, but, uh... I don't care. Uh, what's it called? I wanna say Bobbi Brown.

[00:16:32] Andrea: Oh, I know that. It's that stuff that you were telling me about. I can't remember the name of it.

[00:16:36] Carmen: Whatever it is, but I put a little bit of that, and it's like a little glistening, you know what I mean?

[00:16:40] Andrea: Okay. Looking good. Looking good.

[00:16:42] Carmen: Thank you. Um, so we have a lot to talk about today, and oh, so excited.

[00:16:48] I guess I should mention that... Oh, wait. Sorry. Um, I got four phone calls this morning, none of them about anything helpful money-wise or whatever. Just, "

[00:17:02] Andrea: That 

[00:17:03] Carmen: random clients who I don't work for anymore who are like, "Hey, could you..." I'm like, "Yeah, all right." Like... Exactly.

[00:17:09] Andrea: $4,000, please."

[00:17:13] Carmen: We're gonna implement that stipend back again, but, um, no, there's, like, a little drama going on because scammers are gonna keep scamming people, and so-- but people keep answering the phone calls and talking to them. And I'm like, your bank...

[00:17:30] Andrea: to

[00:17:31] Carmen: Yeah, it's like your bank is never going to call you, especially if it's not your principal banker that you have a relationship with.

[00:17:40] So if somebody's calling you from a bank to ask you how you feel about your services, that's not your bank, okay? That's not your bank, 

[00:17:50] Andrea: Like, if you really, really think it's actually a person or, you know, true, like, be like, "Hang up and call your bank.

[00:17:58] Carmen: Exactly. But, but I, I will give them credit. They called me. So they-- So the client was like, "I have to talk to my business manager." Now, here's the little snafu, not your business manager anymore. Do you know what I mean? But it was okay.

[00:18:14] Andrea: that will now be $8,000.

[00:18:18] Carmen: so funny, so. It's fine 'cause I love my people, but anyways.

[00:18:22] Um, Trump is in China as we're doing this. he's meeting with, Xi Jinping, I think I'm saying his name correctly. and I think it's interesting. I didn't understand what the issue was with China and Taiwan, so I thought I would just give a little kind of Carmen version of what that whole situation is.

[00:18:49] Because it didn't make sense to me, right? China is huge, and that right next to it, like the southeast corner, is Taiwan. It's a little tiny country. And I'm like, I don't know what the whole civil war was or what all the drama was, but the reason why Taiwan has so much power, and I did not know this, is because they make all the chips that we use around the world, like for,

[00:19:12] iPhones, laptops, medical equipment, fighter jets, and satellites. And so that's what makes them... 'Cause I couldn't understand, right? Um, and so they, they have a lot more power than I ever understood, and the president of Taiwan is Lai Ching-te, AKA William Lai, 'cause he goes by William Lai.

[00:19:39] and I just thought that was an interesting kind of thing, and anybody who keeps calling Taiwan a separate country when talking about China is why China gets upset, because China still considers Taiwan or wants to consider Taiwan part of China, and Taiwanese people want, never want to,associate or be considered Chinese, right?

[00:20:06] That's the gist of it. And I, I just, I love that I'm learning. I love that I'm learning. I want other people to learn, too. So that's what's happening right now. Trump is in China thinking he's going to talk about something else regarding Iran and everything else, and all Xi Jinping wants to talk about is the Taiwan-China situation.

[00:20:29] Andrea: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. What are you gonna do when I invade Taiwan?

[00:20:32] Carmen: Exactly, right. Whose side are you on, right? Is basically what's happening. So that's an interesting thing. Thought I would just share with people 'cause I assume... And maybe it's not. Maybe it's just me having to learn, like maybe everybody else on the planet knows stuff. But I know that's not true 'cause y'all talk out your ass.

[00:20:48] so I'll just say this about Xi Jinping meeting or not meeting Donald Trump at the tarmac at the airport.

[00:20:55] There is this thing going on that Barack O- that when Barack Obama showed up in China, that he did, and there was a red car. All of that is a lie. Xi Jinping is not going to show up at the airport for any American president or any president of any country. And I just wanna dispel that, even though I love all these AI imageries of, like, Barack Obama being loved when he came to China, you know what I mean?

[00:21:20] And, uh, but people like Xi Jinping are not going to do that, you know? That's their power, their thing. You're gonna sh- by the way, I don't think Donald Trump shows up at the airport for anyone. So... Or...

[00:21:37] Andrea: carpet for

[00:21:39] Carmen: Oh, Putin. Putin. My bad. My bad. What do I know? Whatever. Anyway, I just wanted to give a little review of China before we get into other stuff, unless you have anything you wanna say about it.

[00:21:54] Andrea: I, I don't, I don't. I'm not fully checked in on that.

[00:21:58] Carmen: Um, let's talk about Trump's obsession with Obama. It's weird. Did you see the Reflecting Pool picture of, like, it was basically the cesspool of garbage, and then he had Barack Obama and Nancy Pelosi, and I don't-- and Joe Biden, I guess, or somebody, in the pool. Because the Reflecting Pool is not a pool, but he had them in there, like...

[00:22:23] Andrea: You're not supposed to go in there.

[00:22:26] Carmen: In the Reflecting Pool. But, uh, that's a whole other conversation. But, what do you think is his obsession with Barack Obama? I'm just curious.

[00:22:33] Andrea: I think it's really simple, and I think it's really obvious. Barack Obama is smarter Cooler, happier, uh, better looking, and loved. Not just by the people at large, but by the actual people in his life. These are things that Donald Trump has never had and always wanted. And here's this man, a Black man, that's important, who has all of these things, and then we can't forget the whole, like, made fun of him publicly.

[00:23:09] Carmen: And the birtherism crap. Oh, oh, you mean, you mean Barack Obama making fun of him at the Correspondents' Dinner,

[00:23:16] Andrea: Yeah. I mean, I don't think that that's everything, but I think, you know, like many of these people whose brains ac- absolutely broke could not handle a Black man being president of the United States.

[00:23:29] Carmen: Yeah, McConnell, all those people. I-- You know, I think it's an interesting thing 'cause he doesn't go after Bill Clinton at all. Like, he doesn't go after even-- He, he does go after Joe Biden, but only to call him Sleepy Jo- though you're not hearing that anymore because somebody else is sleeping on camera all the time, but whatever.

[00:23:48] Um, but you know what

[00:23:49] Andrea: Literally every day.

[00:23:50] Carmen: Yeah, every day. And now that Barack Obama has the, Obama Center, I don't even know what it's called, but opening in Chicago, his museum,and it looks really... I still don't understand the for- like, what it, the architectural thing, but I trust Obama, so. But the layout and the campus and everything that it's offering looks really beautiful, 

[00:24:10] I think a lot of people are jealous of Barack Obama, even just his swagger, you know what I mean?

[00:24:17] But being jealous doesn't mean you're cruel or mean or evil, Like, you can be jealous of somebody there are a lot of people I'm s- like, I'm super jealous of Lin-Manuel Miranda, but I am so happy for him, you know what I mean? And all of his success. but his jealousy is from a place of hate, and I think it's about being Black and being cooler and loved.

[00:24:41] Andrea: a broken shell of a human. So that's kind of the difference between the way you might feel about Lin-Manuel Miranda and the way he feels about Barack Obama. You know what I mean? Like, there's definitely absolutely racism, but he-- I, I think he feels that way really about anybody who has all of these things that he's never had and never will

[00:25:06] Carmen: Right. And I think that's his-- that's why he wants adulation so much, 'cause he, he like forces it on people, "Look at me, look at all the things I've done." And then he lies. He's continuously lying because he wants you to love him, and but it's all fake and it's not real, and down, not even deep inside, I think right surface-y, he knows that.

[00:25:29] You know what I mean? Like,

[00:25:30] Andrea: Totally agree. Totally agree.

[00:25:32] Carmen: Yeah, and he has fake power, which I've always talked about. His power is not from a place of respect. And I think that's what it is. Even if you don't like Barack Obama, people respect him, and that you can't... It don't matter how much money you got, that, you can't buy that.

[00:25:47] Andrea: You cannot.

[00:25:49] Th-that's who he is. I mean, that's, that is who he is. He's Barry. You know what I mean? Like...

[00:25:55] Carmen: on my walk. I think I wanna have like a swagger," you know what I mean? Like, in like the last parts of my life, I wanna be remembered as somebody who would swag. I don't know, but yeah. Anyways, I thought that was an interesting thing. I was kind of like, I, I really... He really hates people and it's from a place of jealousy, not because of anything that they did, you know?

[00:26:19] But it's, it's a weird thing. I don't know. I think it's weird, but I think everything about this man is horribly weird.

[00:26:27] Andrea: yeah. I mean, he's just broken in every possible way, right? And, and a lot of these folks are, right? I mean, that-that's, that's why they resonate with him.

[00:26:38] Carmen: 

[00:26:38] Andrea: People are sad. People are, I don't know. You know, it's-- Uh, everything's a hot mess right now. I mean, there's just no denying it. And, and I think, um, you know, we didn't get to talk to-- about, you know, VRA and all of that that happened 'cause I was out last week. But,

[00:27:00] Carmen: Wait, what is VRA?

[00:27:01] Andrea: the Voting Rights Amendment and what

[00:27:03] Carmen: Oh, 

[00:27:03] Andrea: with the... You know what I mean? Like we, uh, and I-- Like it's I am more radicalized than I even was, and you know how far over I was. But I just, you know, like, like hoods are off, okay? At this-- I'm never gonna say any of this was a good thing,

[00:27:23] Carmen: Right.

[00:27:25] Andrea: we now know that, that what is happening is just unrestrained, overt racism.

[00:27:34] There is no denying it. If you're denying it, you're part of the problem. And, and I think that we now know what, what is the work that we have to do, right? And I think, uh, people that-- You have the people who are sort of bought into it and, and you know, they're fine with it. And, and then you have people who are kind of, I think, having their eyes really opened in real time and be like, "Oh yeah, may- maybe this is a little bit about race."

[00:28:04] And it's hard.

[00:28:05] Carmen: Lookit, my face is over here because, and I say this with my full chest, I-- none of this is surprising. Like, uh, I am a Black Latina woman, and it doesn't matter. We have been saying this forever, and now it's just getting to the point where people are seeing it in a different light. So for people who don't know, the Vi- the Voting Rights Act of nine- it's 1965, 

[00:28:29] But it was put in place so that people could vote without all of this testing crap that was happening, right? So if you were a Black person and you were going to go vote, they would, because they were racist and don't think Black people have the same rights as other people, they would say things like You need to, recite the Constitution, blah, blah, blah, whatever, the preamble.

[00:28:57] And th- there's a great video that kind of shows this, 

[00:29:01] Arraynow SELMA: You work for Mr. Dunn down at the rest home, ain't that right? Yes, sir. Wonder what old Dunn will say when I tell him one of his gals down here is stirring a fuss. I ain't stirring no fuss. I'm just here trying to register to vote.

[00:29:23] It's all right this time. It's right when I say it's right.

[00:29:30] Recite the Constitution's preamble. You know what a preamble is?

[00:29:42] We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, ensure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defense, promote the general Welfare- How many county judges in Alabama?

[00:30:10] 67.

[00:30:16] Name them.

[00:30:32] Carmen: And so they would do this all the time, and so part of why this was put in place was to stop that, was to stop people from making it hard for everyone to vote, is the gist, right?

[00:30:49] Andrea: Yep.

[00:30:50] Carmen: the Supreme Court the other day, 

[00:30:52] I'm just gonna read a little bit about the Voting Rights Act. it's a law from 1965, as I said earlier, that was made to stop unfair rules that kept Black Americans from voting.

[00:31:02] its whole purpose was to make sure everyone could vote equally. 

[00:31:06] So on April 29th, the Supreme Court, in a 6-3 decision in Louisiana v. Callas, severely narrowed Section 2 of the Voting Rights Act, making it harder to challenge voting maps that dilute minority voting power. The ruling declared that creating a second majority Black district in Louisiana was unconstitutionally, unconstitutional racial gerrymander, weakening the VRA's ability to combat racial vote dilution.

[00:31:37] I don't even know what, how that last part meant.

[00:31:40] Andrea: basically what that means is they can-- they, they open the door to, you know, political gerrymandering as long as you call it that, right? So it's still racial because they're trying to make the districts more white, right? But if you say that it's political, that's okay, versus saying that it's racial.

[00:32:01] Carmen: Right.

[00:32:03] Andrea: And so that's why you have all of these southern states basically going back to fucking 1859 where they're like, "Okay, there will be no, uh, you know, essentially Democrat or, you know, Black representatives in our state. We're gonna draw the maps so that it's all white all the time."

[00:32:22] Carmen: I think it's interesting because in my, in, I don't know, in my soul somewhere I want to b- I know it's not true, but I want to believe that white folk think we live in a time where everything is equal. And so, like in the utopia world, if race wasn't an issue, we would all just vote and there would be just as many people of color as there are white people.

[00:32:49] Like it would-- You know, we live in this harmonious place, and so some people in their heads are like, "Yes, we have to get rid of this 'cause it's unfair, it's racial." We do not live in that time. I cannot express to you, we do not live in that time. That is fairyland. You are taking us back tenfold, and that is really what you want.

[00:33:10] You don't want people who are not white in power. You don't want women in power. You-- It's true! It's just, let's sh- uh, 

[00:33:19] Andrea: Girl, I, I believe these motherfuckers want raci- or want slavery again. I 100% believe that, 100%. And I know that sounds crazy and I talk a lot of shit, but, like, if they can-- they're headed in that direction. That's where they wanna go.

[00:33:33] Carmen: Yeah. They don't want... Yeah. They don't want people... Like, you know what's so weird? I've never, ever, ever believed this. Like, I never wanted to believe that what I'm gonna say is coming out of my mouth, but you know, Black people and people of color are so much better than white folk in the United States right now, and I, it fucking kills me to say that.

[00:33:53] It-- Well, it d- it kills me to say it because it's not the world I wanna believe in. It's not what I've ever believed in, and I know that my, whoever my biological father is, the other half of me is white. You know what I mean? But it, it's true. And so this, this is what pisses me off. It's like you are showing every single day with your allegiance to Donald Trump, you are showing how much you hate Black folk.

[00:34:18] That's all you're showing.

[00:34:20] Andrea: Well, not only that, but how fearful you are of there being even close to an equal playing ground. 

[00:34:30] Carmen: But 

[00:34:30] Andrea: It was never equal, right? It's still, it was ne- even, you know, when we thought things were okay, it was never equal. But even people getting close and certainly having a Black president, right? Just, like, they cannot compete on that.

[00:34:47] Carmen: And then but why? Okay, what is it? Okay, here's my thing. I just need to know, what is it about Black folk that white people don't like? I don't understand. Like, and you wanna live in a world where it's like eye color, right? So you have, you have blue eyes, right?

[00:35:03] Andrea: Mm-hmm.

[00:35:03] Carmen: You have blue eyes, I have brown eyes. That's never what makes one of us better or worse than each other.

[00:35:08] So you wanna live in this world where supposedly we're equal, but we're not, and everything you're doing is showing that we're not equal because you won't admit to what happened to this country and our history of this country that keeps pushing us down, and then you do shit like this Supreme Court. Man, I hate the Supreme Court so much.

[00:35:31] Whatever president comes in on the Democratic side has to turn around and add more Supreme Court justices because we need to get rid of this bullshit. I mean, John Roberts, fuck you. Like, every day, on Sunday twice, like I hate you so much. Like, 'cause he's been trying to do this gutting the Voting Rights Act since day one of his fucking existence.

[00:35:54] Like, he has hated this.

[00:35:56] Andrea: Yep. One of the most racist people in the history of this country that has power, for sure.

[00:36:04] Carmen: Well, and major power, I mean, he's the chief justice. Okay. So Andrea, I know that you don't represent these white folk, but you might have some more info. What is it that they hate about Black people? I don't get it.

[00:36:17] Andrea: Well, let me speak for all white people and all

[00:36:20] Carmen: Let me put on my Karen hat, right?

[00:36:23] Andrea: right? Um,

[00:36:25] Carmen: Like...

[00:36:25] Andrea: I, I don't know. I don't know. Um, I think, uh, I've talked about this before. I think that there is actual fear that what was done to Black folks will be done to white folks. I think they actually fear that.

[00:36:40] Carmen: Really? So, so we'd have white slaves? We'd have white slaves?

[00:36:44] Andrea: I don't know. You know, like I, I think that they really fear, like, backlash. You know what I mean? Like, I think that that's, um, there. I also think, and this is, I'm just talking out of my ass off the top of my head, right? Like, I think that white folks understand that our culture is very much driven by Black folks, people of color, and they recognize that they don't have that juice.

[00:37:12] Right? They don't have that juice. They don't have that swagger, right? Like, where, where am I gonna be as a white person if I, if I can't compete with that? I, I don't know. These are just

[00:37:27] Carmen: Lookit, I don't think... Lookit, I don't think Black folk are competing with white folk. I think that's like, that's like the weirdest thing. Like-

[00:37:34] Andrea: I don't know. I'm just throwing it out

[00:37:37] there. 

[00:37:37] Carmen: no, I know, I know. No, no, I know you're right and I'm kidding about you representing all white people. I was just k- joking. I feel-- look it, I, I honestly have never understood the fear, the hatred, the-- I, I've never understood it.

[00:37:52] It's always been kind of sad. But even I grew up, when I was growing up and I was a little kid, I was taught to fear my own people, Black men, you know what I mean? Like if you-- 'cause the, the, h- here's the theory. The theory would be like if you're walking in the middle of the street and it's nighttime by yourself and you see, you know, four Black men walking up the street, you should be afraid.

[00:38:13] But somehow that wasn't the same. Like people would, people would roll up their windows, right, when they were in their car if like Black people were driving next to them or something, right? But not when it happened to white men. So there were all these things that you were taught as a kid, right? And it's not like, I'm not saying my family did that.

[00:38:31] I'm saying society, just kind of what you were told. Black men were scary and all of them gangsters, all of them, even though we had people in our own families who were Black. You know what I mean? Like it was weird. And it's this strange idea that Black people are a certain way when actually Black people run the gamut of just like white people.

[00:38:57] Andrea: do all people, yeah.

[00:38:59] Carmen: all people, smart, dumb, funny, not funny, like skinny, fat one, it's the same

[00:39:07] Andrea: Creative, not creative, I mean, like all of

[00:39:09] Carmen: of it.

[00:39:10] Andrea: Yeah.

[00:39:11] Carmen: All of it.

[00:39:12] Andrea: I'm just sort of percolating on it. I also think that there's something to this, this, this idea of like we all know, right, Black people, people of color, in order to succeed, you have got to be so much better than your average white person, right?

[00:39:32] You can't, you can't put a foot wrong. You have to work harder. You have to put up with more shit coming your way. There's all of that, right? And so, you know, the, the utter resilience of people to have been, you know, forced into slavery and to come out winning, to come out joyful, to, you know, all of those things to, to be successful and, you know, even, even just to live, to survive it, right?

[00:40:02] Forget about being successful. I really think that that, like in some people's mind, some white folks' mind, like they could never, right? Like they-- That's why I think there's this fear of the backlash of it because they know they could never.

[00:40:19] Carmen: You know, we're doing this, you know, ICE is still around, by the way. We're not hearing a lot about it, but it just made me realize, like ICE is doing this right now to a lot of Latinos. You know, a lot of farms are having issues, a lot of construction pla- having issues because so many people are being round up and, and I don't wanna lose...

[00:40:37] They've quieted it down 'cause, you 

[00:40:40] Andrea: It's not in the news. It's still happening every single day everywhere.

[00:40:44] Carmen: but it's still happening. But it's the same kind of concept. These people come to this country with hope and joy and possibility of a better future, and they do the hard labor, the hard work, and they are the kindest, nicest, most beautiful people on the planet.

[00:40:59] And yes, African, um, Americans specifically, 'cause I wanna be careful, race is about color and characteristics. Ethnicity is different. Please learn this. So, um, African Americans, uh, who were brought here forcefully, slavery is a very different thing than coming here because you want a better life, okay? They were forced here.

[00:41:27] Andrea: Yeah.

[00:41:28] Carmen: and still-- But, but that's kind of the same thing of like you go through tragedy and trauma, and you learn from that. I'm not saying that's a good thing, but you learn from that, and you have an appreciation and much more compassion and empathy. And I think the problem with white folk is that they don't have compassion and empathy because they keep holding onto fake power, power based on your race.

[00:41:57] Andrea: Yeah.

[00:41:59] Carmen: Yeah, okay. I don't, I don't... How are we gonna solve it, Andrea? I know. I just... Look it, if you're a white person who's still supporting Trump, really I don't know why you're watching this show. I really don't. I don't know. But I think it's, um, a terrible time that we're in. I think we all know that, but I have never in all my life, being around Black people, African American or people of color, including Asian and Latinos, I have never once, I swear to you on my mother's grave, ever heard anyone want to have slaves. I just wanna put that out there. I have never. All people

[00:42:47] Andrea: Oh, God.

[00:42:49] Carmen: I know, but it, I know

[00:42:50] Andrea: No, I know, girl. Like, this is where we are. We have to say this.

[00:42:53] Carmen: This is where we're at. I have-- And I, I, I... Look it, I would be completely against it on s- Because here's the thing, once you are treated a certain way, I have never wanted any white friend of mine to experience racism.

[00:43:07] I have never been like, "You know what, Andrea? You gonna understand something." Uh, never, because it's so heart-wrenchingly cruel and painful. And by the way, because of my privilege of being a light-skinned Black woman, I have never even got it half as bad or maybe even a quarter as bad as people who are darker skinned than me and, and don't have good features, which was such bullshit, or good hair, 'cause that's, that's the other thing they would try to divide, because white people would feel more comfortable with me because they, you know, I'm mixed, right?

[00:43:46] Like mixed. "Oh, you're exotic." It's fucking bullshit, trying to divide us. But that's my privilege, so I am very aware, very aware that I-- even though I've had it bad and I would never wish racism and all the pain that I've dealt with, I can't even imagine what my Black brothers and sisters have actually gone through who are darker skinned than I am.

[00:44:11] Not in a million years. It makes me wanna cry. It does. It makes me like... And having to, having to turn around and get in the middle of people, white people treating someone badly has always been kind of what you feel you need to do when you do have a certain kind of privilege, and that happened too growing up.

[00:44:35] You know what I mean? Getting into the middle of fights with white folk to defend Black folk, and it's what I'm doing right now. Like it's what I'm doing right now.

[00:44:45] Andrea: Yeah. Oh God, it's a, it's a lifelong work, right?

[00:44:50] Carmen: I think white people would be better off if they would just stop treating-- Like doing the work, doing the work of understanding why racism exists and why they are adding to it. Yeah, but they're-- You know what? People who are supporting Trump at this point, it's just a lost cause. Yeah. I don't know what to say anymore.

[00:45:08] Andrea: Yeah.

[00:45:09] Carmen: If... Yeah, all right. Let's get to a better subject, 'cause this one's a good

[00:45:14] Andrea: Sorry I took, I took us down that road.

[00:45:17] Carmen: Yeah, it's your fault, but it's okay. It's a good one. I don't know. Look it, I-- Look it, I know a lot of our follower, not followers, listeners. I know-- I said this the other day too on Friday Night Live. I was like, "All of our..."

[00:45:30] Like as if we have hundreds and thousands, you know what I mean? Thousands of peop- Someday we will. We will. Um, but I don't wanna live in the world that you keep hearing me talk about. Does that make sense? 

[00:45:47] Andrea: Yeah. It, it does. It, it does. It makes a lot of sense. Yeah, I mean, and I think, you know, I think you started off saying like people are sad. Yeah, it's really fucking sad to live in this world right now. It is.

[00:46:03] Carmen: It is. Yeah. But we're gonna keep fighting 'cause here's the thing, and, you know, this is the other part I don't understand. White people, you really think you're gonna win? Like, I don't understand. You-- what do you-- do you think Black folk are gonna go back to be- What is wrong with you? Like,

[00:46:20] Andrea: know.

[00:46:21] Carmen: the irony is, is they wouldn't want that either.

[00:46:23] I- even if they think that's what they... What they want is power and dominance, right? They want to continue becoming, um, to be the people that no matter what, no matter what mediocre way, they're going to win all the time. Like, that's what they want to continue. And, you know, that's why you're cheating.

[00:46:41] That's why you're cheating in redistricting, because you can't actually win an actual fight, a real fight. So what you're gonna do is you're gonna redistrict places like Texas or whatever, and that's why the Supreme Court is doing what they're doing, because you can't win an actual fight with Black folk.

[00:46:57] Like, you're showing your weakness. You're showing your weakness. And the thing that kills me, I'm sorry I'm on my tirade, but here's my thing about Black folk and Latinos. People of color are resilient, and when they get together, like Asian people and Black folk, th- there's... I remember when I was growing up, there was a lot of hate between these two groups because white people were stroking that shit, you know what I mean?

[00:47:23] Asian and Black people all together now. We like, we, we like this, man. We're like, yeah, we're not fucking around. Like, you crazy. Oh my God. All right. Here's the next thing. I'm sorry, do you have anything else you wanna say, representative of all white folk? I'm just kidding. Just kidding.

[00:47:42] Andrea: should I, should I begin my apologies

[00:47:44] Carmen: Yeah.

[00:47:46] Andrea: everybody?

[00:47:46] Carmen: the, the weird thing is, is that we know... Wait, here's the thing. We know that it's not all white folk. That's the problem. Like, we know that.

[00:47:55] Andrea: Mm-hmm.

[00:47:56] Carmen: That's the sad part, because we see the possibility of a really beautiful world we can live in, a beautiful country we can live in. Because without the Quakers, without...

[00:48:08] You know, like, we gotta think about it again. Learn your fucking history. It's like, if you remember how people got through that time period, there were so many people involved, and they were white, making sure that people were being treated well. And the Quakers had an enti- Is it the Quakers, or am I saying the wrong people?

[00:48:29] It was the Quakers, right? Who helped. Yes. Quakers. Okay. Anyways, shout out to Quakers. I'm just saying, like, we're-- this isn't for, for Black and brown folk People of color folk, this isn't about dominance, this is about equality. This is about being treated with decency and humanity, and having a level playing field.

[00:48:56] And I don't know how else to say that. I don't know how else to make you understand that we are not there yet, we've never been there yet, and we keep trying to get there, and you keep pushing us down, and you keep supporting a man who is full of hate and lies and, and, and, and just a horrible human being because you want something so badly, and you can't see that voting for him and, and supporting him is only keeping you further from having the actual life you want.

[00:49:29] Andrea: Yep, that's it right there.

[00:49:33] Carmen: Okay, so let's talk about, um, California politics 'cause it's not really California

[00:49:38] Andrea: That's so mild. I said that's so mild, right? Compared to what's going

[00:49:43] Carmen: Meanwhile, right. Um, okay, Katie... All right. Okay, so for people who don't know, in California, we are going to elect a governor because Governor Newsom is, uh, termed out. He can't run anymore. So, uh, 'cause he had three ter- oh no, he had two terms, but they tried to recall him, right?

[00:50:04] Andrea: Three elections, two terms.

[00:50:06] Carmen: Right. They tried to recall his ass, and we were like, "Yeah, we're not doing this." Anyways...

[00:50:09] Andrea: voted him in. What are we doing?

[00:50:11] Carmen: Yeah, exactly. But let's waste more of our money anyways. Okay. So now we have all these candidates and, uh, besides the fact that just too many people vo- I did get my booklet and everything. I was shooketh. Shooketh, I tell you.

[00:50:25] Yeah. Shooketh. Um, besides that, there's only one... I know.

[00:50:28] Andrea: vote for Barack D. Obama Shaw

[00:50:31] Carmen: I saw that.

[00:50:33] Andrea: or Living for God and Country DeMott?

[00:50:36] Carmen: know.

[00:50:37] Andrea: That's the guy who was all like Zionism this and that and his thing. Yeah.

[00:50:42] Carmen: Um, yeah. I mean, I think the reason why they allow anyone to run is this idea that anyone in the community could run, but I agree with you, there needs to be some standards 'cause that was some bullshit. I just didn't even look at the top, like, I just looked at the top 10 or something.

[00:50:56] I wasn't even gonna bother. Okay. Let's talk about the only woman in the race that I'm aware of that has any percentage, Katie Porter. What is your feeling? What's going on? Let's talk about it.

[00:51:09] Andrea: Okay. I have done extensive Katie Porter research because like when, you know, kind of let the, you know, like... I, I-- It was even like before Swalwell dropped out. Like, I was trying to figure out, all right, what's going on? Why do people hate her so much? 'Cause people really liked her back when she was in Congress and she had the

[00:51:26] whiteboard 

[00:51:26] Carmen: Congress.

[00:51:27] Andrea: Right? And so, um, you know, I got all the hot goss, right? Some shit went down when she was in Congress and,

[00:51:39] Carmen: what? Like what,

[00:51:40] Andrea: So she was on the, like, finance and banking committee. That's where she did all of her whiteboard stuff, right? And Maxine Waters was the chair of that committee and didn't really care for a lot of the theatrics, right?

[00:51:55] Like, it was fine, but the- after a while she was like, literally like, "Put your whiteboard away." And so there was some, you know, feelings, let's say, between the two of them. And then...

[00:52:07] Carmen: go on, I love, I loved her whiteboard thing. Is that a generational thing maybe?

[00:52:13] Andrea: know. I l- this was a, like I read some of this in the Times, like they just did a story a couple, like last week I think. But, but anyway, so there was that. Like, there just, like some people weren't like really down with her tactics, right? And then, and she's a little like bull in a china shop, you know?

[00:52:29] Like, you know, she came in with a squad and a lot of those folks were like, "We came in with a mandate and you guys are gonna change," and a lot of the old guard were like, "Mm-mm, no."

[00:52:38] Carmen: Right.

[00:52:39] Andrea: including Nancy Pelosi. So when Katie Porter got reelected to her seat, um, there was this whole thing with some of the committees, right?

[00:52:48] She was trying to be on like three committees, and apparently you're only supposed to be on two, but you can get a waiver, which is normally allowed, but Pelosi didn't give her the waiver. And so she didn't stay on that finance and, and banking committee, so she lost that seat. So there was some bad blood there.

[00:53:08] and then, when we had our Senate race, when, a lot of folks got behind, you know, in the Democratic establishment got behind Adam Schiff, right? That w- there, that was the guy. Katie Porter really sort of without having essentially the relationships decided to run.

[00:53:26] Um, and so there was some upset that like, okay, we've already sort of chosen our person who we wanna run, and now we Democrats have to spend money, uh, defending your seat that you have to give up in order to run. So there was just a lot of that like inside politics kind of stuff where she just doesn't have a lot of support from, um, from the Democratic establishment.

[00:53:49] Carmen: Adam Schiff thing? 'Cause this, this is what pissed me off, is Adam Schiff earned that seat as far as I was concerned, and I think that's what bothered me with her is that I felt like she was overstepping, but go ahead.

[00:54:05] Andrea: I w- I mean, uh, for me, I'm like, okay, you don't, you don't, you're not owed a seat. You don't, you know, you have to earn a seat in the campaign and other things, but whatever. So

[00:54:14] Carmen: I'm saying. But anyways, go

[00:54:15] Andrea: yeah. So my point is that- She did not build and establish relationships, right? Which is a thing that you have to do if you want to get things done as a politician, right?

[00:54:32] And so there's sort of all of that, and then there's, you know, talk which, you know, I think is somewhat true, that she's not a great manager. She had a really high turnover rate in her, um, in her office, one of the highest. So, you know, these kinds of things tend to matter. Um, and then there was, like, the, the, um, couple of things that came out where she was, like, uh, yelling at a staffer and got snippy with a 

[00:54:58] Carmen: see, that stuff I don't care about.

[00:55:00] Andrea: Yeah, that 

[00:55:01] Carmen: if a man does it, we don't hear about it. I don't, I don't...

[00:55:04] Andrea: no, true, but I think it's, it goes along with this whole thing about her kind of not

[00:55:10] Carmen: Aggress- being

[00:55:11] Andrea: not being good with people, right? Like, not being a good relationship builder. Um, all of that is all, you know, that is what it is. Um, but I think, you know, in your email you had talked about, like, you said, like, is it misogyny or something along those lines, right?

[00:55:26] And I think, like, yes, obviously that is there as well, right? We- you still hear the things about her voice and the way that she looks, and a lot of these things that are coming out are like, if it was a man, no one would fucking care, right? So I think there is a lot of that too, but, you know, in terms of being able to work in Sacramento and run the state, like, you gotta be able to work with people, and she's kind of established that she's maybe not so great at that.

[00:55:54] Carmen: Yeah, and my whole thing is, I'm gonna say this because people were trying to throw this idea like, "Well, you voted for Hillary, you voted for Kamala, why wouldn't you vote for her?" I'm like, "Because we don't just vote for women because they're women," like that's why. And

[00:56:08] Andrea: Yeah.

[00:56:08] Carmen: before, do you remember this? I mean, I know you remember this.

[00:56:11] Remember you and I when, um, Barack Obama and Hillary Clinton were in the primary together? We were solidly Hillary Clinton fans. It wasn't like...

[00:56:20] Andrea: I voted for Hillary Clinton

[00:56:22] Carmen: Yeah, we weren't like, we weren't like, "Oh, the Black man, let's vote for him." We were like, both of their resumes were so similar, we really went... Like, we really went down the whole thing and, and it wasn't until he became the actual candidate that we were like, "All right, it's ugly behind him."

[00:56:37] Andrea: I remember actually, like, I lived in Virginia when this primary happened, and I voted for her. Like, their primary is a lot earlier than, than California's. I voted for her, and then if you remember, this was a, this was a dog fight of a campaign in the primary, right? Some stuff came out that was, like, a little bit, like, out of my comfort zone in terms of what the Clintons were doing and saying about Barack Obama, and I was like, "Goddammit, I should have waited to vote."

[00:57:09] I would've voted... If that had all happened before I voted, I would've voted for Obama,

[00:57:14] 'cause 

[00:57:14] I didn't like that. 

[00:57:14] Carmen: my reason for not voting for Obama in the primary between the two of them, and I, I was like, I was one of those people that was like, "I don't want a Black man to get killed in office." Like that was... Remember I kept saying that? "He's gonna be assassinated, I'm

[00:57:30] Andrea: Yeah, I remember you saying that.

[00:57:32] Carmen: I was just like...

[00:57:33] Andrea: least initially, was like, h- like he doesn't really have that much experience, you know? I felt like he kinda like

[00:57:40] Carmen: Still, I was more worried about him being assassin- right, but, but, well, because then... Right, that's why we were voting for Hillary. I mean, that's why I was voting for Hillary, because their resumes were so the same. But then when he became the candidate, I was so ner- I-- and you know what? Eight years, eight years, I think I was like waiting to hear the news.

[00:57:58] Not like I am now.

[00:58:01] Andrea: A little, little different in terms of anticipation, right?

[00:58:06] Carmen: Um, but, um, but yeah, lookit, my thing with Katie P- Katie Porter is I'm sad that... I, I love what you said a couple weeks ago. You said it's, like, embarrassing that we don't have more women in the race. I think in general in this country, it's sad that our country is so pathetic that we haven't had more women in office.

[00:58:29] For real! Like, I don't know why we're even playing

[00:58:31] Andrea: really hard, I think, for women... You know, I was thinking about it 'cause I was like, uh, you know, she has all of this stuff, right? And also it's like you have to walk such a thin, razor thin line as a woman. You have to look a certain way, but not too good. And, you know, you have to, uh, you know, be tough, but not too tough.

[00:58:55] You can't be a bitch. You know, God forbid your voice isn't whatever, you know? Like, there's just all of this stuff that's outside of your skills and experience and talents and, you know, what you bring, your issues and all of that kind of stuff. It's just really, really

[00:59:10] hard. 

[00:59:10] Carmen: And, we don't attach that to men. I've never heard anyone say like, "Oh my God, his laugh is so annoying. I don't know if I can

[00:59:17] Andrea: you and I do,

[00:59:19] Carmen: Yeah, you

[00:59:19] Andrea: people don't.

[00:59:21] Carmen: you and I definitely do, that's for sure. 

[00:59:23] Andrea: We're like, "If someone doesn't fix his nose..."

[00:59:25] Carmen: right. Right, right, right. Like, oh, what is... He should've gotten some plastic surgery.

[00:59:28] No, for sure. We're definitely like, "What is that tie?" We'll even do, like, little things like, "Why is he wearing that tie? It is not going with his skin color. The palette is off." Yeah, no. Um, yeah, I... Lookit, I feel bad for Katie Porter for a lot of reasons. She is talented. She is so talented. I, I love Maxine Waters.

[00:59:52] I don't know enough about that whole thing, but there's a part of me also, at some point the generational thing just pisses me off. You know what I mean? Like, I thought the, the whiteboard was great, and as much as I love Maxine Waters and Nancy Pelosi and all these people, I do wish we were like, "Okay, time to retire," you know what I mean?

[01:00:12] And let younger people come up or whatever. And instead of, like,

[01:00:15] Andrea: them make or break it on their own merits, right? Like, let them--

[01:00:18] Don't... 

[01:00:19] Carmen: also, like, what happened to, like, instead of admonishing or being... When, when are you kind of the person who's, like, teaching and... Do you know what I mean? Like-

[01:00:28] Andrea: Yeah, like have a conversation about it, you know? I mean, this I think is some of the, the, the issues with Katie Porter. It was like she didn't learn how to work within the system. It's like, well, then fucking talk to her and tell her. And maybe they did, and she was like, "Fuck it, I'm doing it my way," you know?

[01:00:46] But...

[01:00:46] Carmen: Yeah. I mean, they kinda did the same thing with AOC and that whole group of people, but a- again, some of it, the... Like, there's a part of me that's like some of our laundry should be in, you know, we don't need to have it all out there, but then it's very transparent or whatever.

[01:01:01] But I do hate the idea that women are not really supporting women and helping them move forward. And look it, I'm not trying to say it was Nancy Pelosi's fault or Maxine Waters' fault or whatever, but because, you know, I have my issues with, uh, Porter. I think, again, I know this sounds weird, it's not even about the campaign whatever.

[01:01:20] It's not that Adam Schiff deserved... He earned it. Like, he earned his time and it... And you're right. I remember being like, "We have to now spend all this money watching these people fight over this seat that would've been just easy. Done. Move on." You know what I mean? But yeah, it is what it is. Okay. Well, we didn't get to our other topic at all.

[01:01:44] Andrea: Well,

[01:01:45] Carmen: Hoo, child, it's a lot. But, um, look it, I don't know how we're gonna fix the world. I don't know. I don't even know. Like, I feel like these are our venting sessions 'cause it's what we do on the phone. Um...

[01:01:58] Andrea: think, I think that's, like I have been trying to do less of like looking at like, "Oh, this is fucked up today, and this other thing's fucked up today," and whatever, and trying to look at like, all right, what, what are some solutions? Like when the time comes, and it will come, uh, what are some ways we're gonna fix this?

[01:02:19] So that's, uh, that's all I can do is like I'm just trying to look at, all right, what are solutions and who, who is actually talking about solutions?

[01:02:30] Carmen: Yeah, I don't know. I, h- honestly, I... You're, you're right, and you're talking about, like, just taking a break from the const- it's every day. It's every day. Every day it's something.

[01:02:41] Andrea: day, all day.

[01:02:42] Carmen: yeah, it's, it's just constant. I think you're right. I think for me, I do get into a place of, like, dread about it. Like, I can't belie- I can't believe that this country, this really, the whole possibility of how beautiful this country is and the, and the promise of it, and we're just wasting all this time on hating people of color having any stand whatsoever, you know, these kind of bullshit...

[01:03:12] He's spending all this money on glorifying himself while we have no money for the things we actually need in this country. Arches and gold and putting his name on shit and gold statues. I'm like... 

[01:03:32] Andrea: We have the potential to be what we think we are or thought we were anyway, right? We have the potential to be so, so great, and we're just

[01:03:44] Carmen: Blah, blah,

[01:03:46] Andrea: it, wasting all of this potential,

[01:03:49] Carmen: Yeah, and it's gonna take a long time to climb back. I mean, I think the surface-y stuff will be easy to do, like, you know, taking down his name off shit and whatever. That's, that's gonna be the easy part. But I,

[01:04:01] Andrea: know, like pay people to like, you know,

[01:04:03] Carmen: I don't think you're gonna have to. I don't think... I think people just gonna go and take the name down themselves,

[01:04:09] Andrea: Yeah. Well, I meant, I guess I meant the other way. People will pay, be like, "Let me, let me have a crack at it," right?

[01:04:14] Carmen: lying. I don't, I don't think that's gonna be the hard part. I think the hard part is gonna be all the, like, the trust back in the FBI, the trust back in... The, that's gonna take

[01:04:25] Andrea: That's 

[01:04:26] Carmen: a generation. Yeah.

[01:04:28] it's generational, so. All right. With that, um, find joy somewhere, baby, 'cause it ain't here today, you know, so.

[01:04:36] Look it, at the end of the day, it really is all about the joy. And look it, we talk about this so we can get it out, and maybe it helps you, and you vent a little bit or think a little bit, and then we move on through, right?

[01:04:48] Andrea: That's right. One foot in front of the other.

[01:04:50] Carmen: yeah. Have a great one, and we'll see you guys next week. Bye, everyone.

[01:04:54] Andrea: Mia.

[01:04:55] Carmen: Okay