Masculinity Isn’t the Problem - The Definition Is

In this episode of Culture and Consequence, Andrea and I dive into the latest flare‑up around “toxic masculinity” — from Scott Galloway’s outdated framing to Dr. Mike’s defensive stumble online — and why the real issue isn’t men themselves, but the broken structure of what we’ve been taught masculinity is supposed to be. We talk about performance vs. authenticity, why vulnerability is strength, and how rigid gender expectations shape everything from politics to media to the way power is abused in this country.

From the MAGA obsession with faux‑toughness to the collapse of journalistic institutions like 60 Minutes, we connect the dots between gender, ego, media capture, and the erosion of our moral core. And yes, we even detour into Ivanka Trump “discovering” an island — because of course we do.

It’s messy, honest, funny, and very us.

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As always, remember it really is All About The Joy.

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Music By Geovane Bruno, Moments, 3481
Editing by Team A-J
Host, Carmen Lezeth


DISCLAIMER:  As always, please do your own research and understand that the opinions in this podcast and livestream are meant for entertainment purposes only. States and other areas may have different rules and regulations governing certain aspects discussed in this podcast.  Nothing in our podcast or livestream is meant to be medical or legal advice. Please use common sense, and when in doubt, ask a professional for advice, assistance, help and guidance. 

Transcript

[00:00:16] Carmen: And I, I just do not have the ability to go and get my hair done. Do you need to go? We can wait

[00:00:22] Andrea: No, no, no. I-- the cat's at the door, but I'm just gonna ignore him.

[00:00:26] Carmen: Did you say your cat is at the door?

[00:00:29] Andrea: Yeah, I have the door closed and he's, you know

[00:00:36] Carmen: Sorry, I don't have any pets, so

[00:00:38] Andrea: his little paws are probably underneath trying to open it right now

[00:00:42] Carmen: Oh, see, I don't have animals, so I don't, I don't... It was just a funny, for me it was an odd thing to hear. The cat is at

[00:00:50] Andrea: He's all like

[00:00:50] Carmen: And I'm like, "What?" Um, so I know we have, like, an agenda or whatever to talk or, you know, we, but I, I wanna talk about something else for a moment if you don't mind.

[00:01:05] Andrea: I don't mind.

[00:01:06] Carmen: There's this topic of toxic masculinity that is on fire again on social media. I don't know if you know that, but, um, and this morning I responded

[00:01:19] Andrea: roll my eyes big enough. Sorry.

[00:01:22] Carmen: Why? Wait, why are you rolling your eyes? Oh, you don't wanna talk about it

[00:01:27] Andrea: no. I just l- want those toxic masculinity people or, well, anyway, I'm sorry. Go ahead. Go ahead.

[00:01:34] Carmen: No, no, it's totally cool. Do you know who Scott Galloway is? Doesn't

[00:01:37] Andrea: Yes, we had a whole conversation about it.

[00:01:39] Carmen: We had a whole conversation about it. Right, right. Okay. So you do know about that. There was a whole show about it, and his kind of whole premise is because men can't plant their seed because women, you know, have jobs now, and, uh, and, and we have to...

[00:01:55] Like, and he kept doing that, "And we have to be happy about that. We embrace that." But because men can't spread their seed and they can't find a woman, they have, you know, they're, they're being repressed somehow. And y- he was doing... Like, the irony is, is that he was in trying to talk about toxic masculinity, he was exhibiting exactly what toxic masculinity is, right?

[00:02:21] That's... Okay. So this morning I woke up and I happened to be, looking at, uh, I follow Dr. Mike. Do you know who Dr. Mike is? You probably don't know who Dr. Mike is. Doesn't matter. Dr. Mike is very well-known. Everybody loves him. I love him. We all think he's great. But he made a mistake today, and so people are calling him out on it.

[00:02:45] He had Dr. Ali on his show and, um, suffice it to say, he put out a clip, and in the clip, another content creator who is very well-known for his love army, whose name is, uh, Barrett Paul, who I don't really follow, but I love him, he's great, turned around and said, "People have been talking about toxic masculinity forever."

[00:03:11] Like, first of all, women have been talking about toxic masculinity forever like, since the beginning of time, I'm

[00:03:21] Andrea: of time.

[00:03:23] Carmen: Yeah, right. But what, um, Barrett Paul was saying is gay people, gay men, the LGBTQ community, has also been talking about toxic masculinity and that people don't listen to gay men about toxic masculinity because they think they're not masculine And Dr.

[00:03:46] Mike responded in such a defensive way. I mean, and it was an odd thing to see 'cause, uh, you know, he's usually pretty nuanced or whatever, and he was like, "I'm a me- medical professional," and, you know, basically, I'm like, "Oh my God, how do they not see this?" I just wanted to get your idea of the state of men and toxic masculinity in this country, 'cause I... Anyways, I just think it's an interesting conversation to have. By the way,

[00:04:21] Andrea: I don't have anything good to say about the state of men right now.

[00:04:24] Carmen: No, no, no, I know. But here's the thing, toxic masculinity is the reason why, part of the reason why we have this man in office right now and all of these unqualified people running this country.

[00:04:37] Andrea: Yep.

[00:04:38] Carmen: And when I say running, I mean it in quotes

[00:04:44] Andrea: Yeah, I mean, hmm, I don't, I don't really know where to go. Like, it's, uh

[00:04:50] Carmen: We, we don't have to talk about it if you don't want to. I just needed to vent

[00:04:53] Andrea: No, it's fine. I'm kind of like, what do I even wanna say about it? Yeah, I mean, toxic max- masculinity is a huge problem. I think some people darn-- don't really fully understand what that means and, you know, certainly with the people in this administration, it feels like everything kinda comes back to gender and, like, performing gender in some way.

[00:05:16] Um, you know, like Hegseth and whatever is trying to be all, like, macho and showing himself working out, and it's like you're just

[00:05:27] Carmen: Wait a minute. Wait a minute. Wait a minute. Wait a minute

[00:05:30] Andrea: you're so uncomfortable with who you actually are that it actually makes you look less masculine, right? Like, you just...

[00:05:41] Carmen: Okay

[00:05:42] Andrea: And even, like, Trump, like I, I read this somewhere, like I don't know if this is kind of where you wanted to go with it, but it's like he is held up by all the MAGA people as like this hyper-masculine, super tough, you know, but he's like massively, massively overweight, doesn't take care of himself, wears makeup every single day, has this crazy-ass whatever is happening on top of his head, can't dress for shit.

[00:06:07] I mean, like, this is your model of masculinity? Like, there's something wrong in your head. know.

[00:06:15] Carmen: I'm sorry. I just, I, I have to gasp because Pete Hegseth working out, like even, even I can do a better

[00:06:25] Andrea: the video of him on the boat and doing his little dance moves?

[00:06:30] Carmen: Oh, yes,

[00:06:31] Andrea: It looked like someone at an aerobics class.

[00:06:34] Carmen: Yeah. Yeah. It was with the, it, it was with the military people, right? Uh, the Air Force people or whatever, and he was like tap dancing or whatever and not understanding that that's not how you do those crossovers.

[00:06:45] Yeah.

[00:06:46] Andrea: Well,

[00:06:47] Carmen: It was

[00:06:48] Andrea: just looked like, like a really, someone in a dance class that didn't know what they were doing is what it

[00:06:54] Carmen: And look at, here's the thing, he doesn't even have to, right? The, the, the, the problem is isn't how he does his bad pull-ups or how he prances without actually knowing how to do these crossover sprint moves. The problem is that they try to pretend that's the definition of masculinity, right? It's, that, that, that actually is the problem, is they're pretending that they are so great at so many things, and actually they suck at all of it.

[00:07:25] All of it, they suck

[00:07:27] Andrea: Yeah. I mean, that's why they have to pretend. They're performing. They're performing masculinity. Like, "Okay, I'm gonna get these tattoos and I'm gonna make sure my biceps are this big, but my legs are like little sticks." I mean, like, you know what I mean? Like, they're just performing it because they act- they don't actually know what it is

[00:07:48] Carmen: They don't know what it is, and this is what I'm gonna say. And that's why you step on people who you think are less than you or are more vulnerable, whether it's immigrants or whatever, Black people or dark-skinned people or people who are poor. You step on those people because it makes you feel manly.

[00:08:05] It makes you feel like you're doing something. And, and actually the most masculine, like the most men that are actually masculine are the people that would take care of those people. That would be the people who would, um, embrace those people and find a way to help them. Um, I'm gonna say something that is not, uh...

[00:08:28] Because I'm gonna say it, and then everybody else will say it who actually has, like, power or whatever. So I thought I'd just throw it out there 'cause I think it's important enough to share with the world. Timestamp it again, 'cause this is like the fourth thing that's gonna happen. Here you go.

[00:08:45] Masculinity, the problem with toxic masculinity is that the structure of what we believe masculinity is, is completely wrong. Men need to evolve, and the men who have evolved, this is a blanket statement, tend to be gay men. Because they have been able to embrace... I know it's a blanket statement, but I'm just saying they've been able to embrace their feminine side.

[00:09:15] This idea that men's purpose on the planet is to plant your seed every- Bitch, I wanna have sex all the time too. But I'm just saying, I'm serious. Like, this idea that, you know, that's why I got so mad at Scott Galloway. Like, what is wrong with you? We evolve as humans. Our, our whole purpose isn't just to pro- procreate anymore.

[00:09:39] That's not what our only purpose is on the planet, because we have evolved. And when you evolve, you become someone who can be vulnerable, who can be sad, who can be miserable or, or scared or afraid, not just all the other things that you guys think masculinity is. Okay, timestamp, right? June 4th, and it's like whatever time.

[00:10:04] I said it first. We're gonna watch all these people be like, "We need to dismantle masculinity." It's all gonna come out. Just saying. But look at, and, and gay men have been around at least since I've been alive, since at least when I even understood in the '80s. No, no, but I'm just saying, I remember '80s and the AIDS crisis, and we lost so many good people, and I just, that's when I started understanding there was a, a problem, you know, quote unquote, "with gay people," because I was confused.

[00:10:33] Why weren't we all sad? Why were people so hating gay people in the '80s? Those were the most masculine people I knew. I can name 10 people that I was like, "Those are..." You know what I mean? Like, that's what bothers me is masculinity, the definition has been wrong for a long time. Okay, I'll be quiet now.

[00:10:54] Andrea: No, I, I completely agree, and I'm gonna, I'm gonna feel free to speak for all women, um, right now

[00:10:59] Carmen: Please do. Please do. I'm okay with that. Please do

[00:11:03] Andrea: y- say that I, I think we would, most of us anyway, agree that when we think of what's actually masculine, it's caring for other people, being able to talk about your feelings, uh, you know, being kind, being empathetic, taking care, not, uh, punching down or looking down on other people.

[00:11:27] I mean, there are a lot of things in that realm that I would say we look at that and say, "That's a, that is a man that I wanna be with, whose seed I would like planted in me." I get

[00:11:44] Carmen: thing is weird, dude. Like,

[00:11:46] Andrea: It's so gross. It's so gross. Stop saying that. Ugh.

[00:11:50] Carmen: No, no, but it's a

[00:11:52] Andrea: It is.

[00:11:53] Carmen: it, I think, I, women-- Okay, this is g- a- another one, we're time stamping it, but here's the thing. When women show that they are powerful, when they show that they are, you know, in charge of things, um, whatever, we, we say they're aggressive or they're bitchy or whatever.

[00:12:11] How come we don't say, "Wow, she has a lot of masculine qualities," you know what I mean? Like, we don't because we're like, "No, because that means, like, something butch," or what- Right? We-- But why isn't that seen as masculine, right? Like, let's just say, like, and then men trying to be more sensitive and emotional and in touch with who they are, more of the feminine side.

[00:12:35] I mean, I just get so... It, it shouldn't be, but what we do with women when they show these powerful parts of who they are, we negate them, we put them down. They're a bitch, they're a this, they're a that. And I just think the whole masculine terminology needs to change. And I, I feel grateful that I, I've said this before, that I grew up the way I did.

[00:12:57] I grew up around so many gay men. I'm sure gay women too, but I just-- They didn't reveal themselves as easily as I remember as a kid. Um, I found out a lot of women were lesbians later on, but I didn't know while I was there. But men who were gay, especially during the gay, um... I was gonna say the gay crisis, that's really bad.

[00:13:22] The AIDS crisis.

[00:13:23] Andrea: was a gay crisis.

[00:13:24] Carmen: it was horrible. Um, I, I think that was the learning moment for me, and I just remember being the most manliest men that I know. Um, like Billy, who's like my brother from another mother. I- he is, he's gay and married and has two beautiful children, and is probably one of the most masculine men I've ever known.

[00:13:51] And I feel so blessed to have always grown up in that kind of environment where masculinity was about you could wear a pink shirt, you know what I mean? Like, I don't know about you, but I remember that being a big deal. Like if s- if a guy wore a pink shirt, it was some weird, stupid thing. Or the earring.

[00:14:13] Do you remember the earring thing? 

[00:14:14] Andrea: The earring, right? Was like one side, if you wore it on one side it was gay, and if you wore it on the other side you were, like, not gay? I

[00:14:22] Carmen: Yeah, and then Harrison Ford and Morgan Freeman both wore earrings and it, or, or George Michael wore earrings and everybody was done with the whole controversy. I'm still in denial that George Michael was gay. I'm sorry, still.

[00:14:37] Andrea: Yeah, I mean, look, I think, you know, as with anything, you sort of pull back, like humans are complex. There is a spectrum. We have masculine qualities, we have feminine qualities, or we just have qualities, let's say,

[00:14:52] Carmen: Yeah. But we're never gonna

[00:14:53] Andrea: call them whatever we want. Um, and I think you're right though, this idea of what is masculine, um, it is, uh, you know, the definition of it has, has been wrong for a really long time

[00:15:07] Carmen: For a really long time, and it's stunning to me that somebody who's a professor and a doctor, uh, can't get it right. But maybe it's because they are men and they're so in it, you know? Uh. Yeah. But men get very defensive, right? So especially i- as a woman, you know that. Like, the minute you push back on them, and this has happened i- in, like, this year with me and men even just online.

[00:15:32] Like, if you push back and say, "No, I won't tolerate that," then I'm the bitch, I'm the this. It's not like, "Oh, let me self-reflect and think what could I have possibly done wrong to have gotten Carmen upset?" It's, "No, Carmen is wrong because I guess you thought you could plant your seeds somewhere." I have no idea what the problem is.

[00:15:53] But they get very upset. Like, they get very appalled that a woman would call them out

[00:16:00] Andrea: Men are very emotional

[00:16:04] Carmen: And, and high

[00:16:05] Andrea: and sensitive and high maintenance. All of the things, all of the reasons why we can't have a woman in office. No, girl. The men are so emotional and so hypersensitive to any little slight at all, you

[00:16:23] Carmen: Well, look at, well, look at, what's his name? What's this man's name? Donald Trump. I was gonna say Don Johnson because I was just watching some Miami Vice clips. Somebody has been putting out Miami Vice clips. Like, remember Miami Vice? That show was

[00:16:36] Andrea: show.

[00:16:37] Carmen: Oh my God, and Don Johnson was, like, the definition of, like, masculine, wearing a pink, silky T-shirt and his white, yeah, and his no-sock shoes, you know what I mean?

[00:16:50] Andrea: right. Yeah, the no

[00:16:51] Carmen: God.

[00:16:52] Andrea: right? The very loose-fitting suit.

[00:16:54] Carmen: very le- like, and, uh, and they were interviewing him, and he said it was like wearing pajamas. Uh,

[00:17:00] Andrea: I'm down

[00:17:01] Carmen: like, "Baby, you were fine, though. You and Tubbs was fine, Crockie." The epitome of masculinity, right? And they kinda broke that whole thing. Um, but yeah, Donald Trump is so overly sensitive.

[00:17:15] Everything gets him in a tizzy, you know what I mean? And it's like, that's what you guys put on a pedestal of, like

[00:17:23] Andrea: A whiny little bitch

[00:17:25] Carmen: He's a whiny little bitch. It's so weird. Yeah, I'm gonna put that clip up of Pete Hegseth doing that if I can find it. Like,

[00:17:37] Andrea: I was like,

[00:17:39] Carmen: I was so... I'm like, "Girl. Girl, what are you doing?"

[00:17:43] Andrea: Stop doing that.

[00:17:45] Carmen: Oh, anyways. All right, well let's move on. I- thank you for indulging me. I just, I needed to get that off my chest. Um, I wanted to see how you're feeling about Scott Pelley getting fired from 60 Minutes

[00:18:00] Andrea: Well, I sort of talked about this last time as sort of the media environment, um, and I was thinking about it kind of big picture and, you know, for most of our lives we've heard about the liberal bias in the media, right? Which I'm coming to understand was never really a liberal bias as much as it was a truth bias, um, or at least an attempt at truth, right?

[00:18:26] And certainly where we are now is that the right wing has captured virtually all media in this country. You know, the network news, the, CNN really, obviously CBS, Fox clearly, all of the social medias, are owned by Trump, you know, supporters. So we're in a bad place. It's really hard to be a journalist who is interested and wants to tell the truth.

[00:18:56] How do you get paid? And it's, and it's like broken up, right? Like you gotta go find someone on Substack, which is a problematic organization also, but like you gotta go find everybody's like personal thing instead of a place or a couple of places, whether it's a newspaper or a, a network or something like that where it's like, okay, I can trust this.

[00:19:20] Um, so it, it's just a sort of a symptom, I think, of this broken down trust and I think it's just, you know, it's, it's horrific. It's really, really awful.

[00:19:30] Carmen: Yeah. Um, I was watching Nicolle Wallace on MS whatever it's called now. Uh... Oh, I guess it's called MS now. Yeah.

[00:19:38] Andrea: MS Now. MS whatever it's called now

[00:19:41] Carmen: Whatever it's called now. And she had on, which was kind of great to see, she had on Don Lemon and, what's the guy from CNN? Um, Acosta, Jim Acosta, who both left or were fired from CNN at different times for different reasons and ended up, they're on Substack and YouTube or whatever. And, uh, she had them on, and it was kind of an interesting conversation to listen to them.

[00:20:13] but yeah, things are broken, and there are less people who have courage now, and that's what they were talking about. They were talking about the thing about Scott Pelley walking away wasn't that he just walked away. He basically screamed and yelled at Barry Weiss or whoever that person is who was the whatever.

[00:20:32] I mean, he was fired for cause, but basically he was fired for being mean to whoever's in charge of 60

[00:20:39] Andrea: and like if I, I read the little transcript that they put out and he was just questioning. Like, you're taking over a show of investigative journalists and you think that they're not gonna ask questions of you when you bring in someone who was wholly unqualified? He was just, he wasn't like y- you know, like I don't know if he was yelling, but you know, he wasn't like cussing anybody out or anything like that.

[00:21:05] He was just stating his thoughts and his, you know, uh, like I don't think it was that bad.

[00:21:11] Carmen: Well, well clearly it was bad because he was questioning, but then when he wrote his thing and he said they were asking h- um, you know, him as a journalist to basically say untruths, I'm like, "That's bad," you know? And the fact that he was like, "And it's time to go," or whatever, and they fired him, I think what's really interesting is if you look at Orban,

[00:21:32] It's not that the leader of a country turns around and says, "I'm going to own all of the media outlets." It's actually what's happening right now, which is the friends of the leader turn around and buy out all of the news organizations, and then manipulate and take over all of the media, and that's exactly what Trump is doing right now.

[00:21:58] Firing Stephen Co- Copare. Stephen Colbert, I can't even say his name right. Colbert. See, he's already gone and I can't remember him. Firing him, trying to go after Jimmy Kimmel, which he's still trying to do, right? Uh, 'cause he's upset with him now. Doing this with Scott, but 60 Minutes is an institution of this country.

[00:22:21] Like, if there's anything we should be proud of, it would be 60 Minutes or PBS, like these great organizations who have stood the test of time and have had the most incredible people work for them and give the most information, and we're just breaking them down and getting rid of it like it's no big deal.

[00:22:41] Andrea: Yeah. Yeah. I mean, there's, look, all kinds of other instances of this outside of the media, right? Like our science and health and, you know, all of that. I mean, it's just, it's just one domino after another to turn us into a shell basically

[00:23:00] Carmen: Well, I think too, people, you said about liberal media, it's like the idea that, PBS or something like 60 Minutes are considered liberal media is because you have allowed yourself to, uh, believe the bullshittery that has been told to you. These are incredible journalists. Um, and I think it's, it's just sad.

[00:23:23] It's so sad to hear people... And yet no one was questioning, like, when Rush Limbaugh was alive and just spewing bullshittery, we weren't like, "That's right-wing media," you know what I mean? And it's bad. It was just like,

[00:23:36] Andrea: Well, we were.

[00:23:37] Carmen: no, we were, but not the people who are calling PBS and... You know what I mean? Like, like you have investigative journalists and then you have a puppet.

[00:23:46] I'm sorry, Rush Limbaugh was an absolute... You know what? He dead. I'm just gonna move on. You know what I mean? Like, we don't need to talk about him. I just...

[00:23:54] Andrea: yeah.

[00:23:55] Carmen: There's enough people alive to be, like... My point is, is it's interesting how you, and I say you, I mean people who want to put things in these sections, but you don't claim your own bullshittery that you believe in, that you will, you know, die on that hill of Rush Limbaugh or whoever the other, who was the other guy who-- Charlie Kirk or whatever it is, and you don't see the lies that they're spewing or were spewing to make you believe something that was not true.

[00:24:28] I have never thought of PBS and, um, 60 Minutes as left-wing media. And if people know me, I have never, ever fully listened to PBS. Why? Because I agree with them all the time. You know what I mean? Like, I, I don't argue with them. They don't-- I'm not saying all of their shows. I'm just saying I tend to wanna listen to, like, Fox News or whatever because I, I don't know, I wanna fucking annoy myself all the time.

[00:24:57] Andrea: Yeah

[00:24:58] Carmen: Well, no, because I wanna know my, quote-unquote, "the opposite of what I truly believe," you know what I mean? So I can learn and maybe change my mind a bit. That doesn't make me a good person, it makes me a, what is it, sadist? I don't know what the right word is, right? 'Cause it's, it drives me insane. But anyways, okay

[00:25:15] Andrea: mean, that's the thing about, uh, uh, you know, whether it's PBS or 60 Minutes or any other, you know, highly qualified investigative journalist, you know, person or outlet or whatever. Like, as far as I remember, they were always perfectly willing to call out people on the, you know, left, Democrats, whatever, right?

[00:25:37] Like, they were investigating a story of some kind, and it led where it led. And if it meant that it was gonna, you know, be critical of someone on the left, they would do that. It's just that, like, people on the right can't handle, again, going back to being emotional and whiny little bitches,

[00:25:59] Carmen: So masculine.

[00:26:00] Andrea: so masculine, right?

[00:26:01] They literally can't handle being called out for their bull- their bullshit

[00:26:04] Carmen: And instead of finding factual reasons to maybe question whatever show you're watching on PBS or 60 Minutes, what they would do is then degrade the shows, label them as liberal, and feed into the bullshittery that makes you easier to hate them and stop watching them, and then be okay with what's happening right now.

[00:26:27] This is how we lose our democracy. It's been chipping away for a long time, but this is how it happens, little by little. Yeah.

[00:26:37] Andrea: by the people who understand, "Oh, this is how I can gain more power."

[00:26:42] Carmen: Which is weird. Like the, the, the wanting of this, again, fake power, it- my terminology, but please feel free to go and use it. Like, but this need to have more and more power, more and more control, like it just, it's a weird concept to me. To, to do what? How much more money do-

[00:27:03] Andrea: like a bottomless pit in your soul. It doesn't matter how much, you're never gonna be fulfilled. You know, it's always gonna

[00:27:10] Carmen: fulfilled. You're right.

[00:27:11] Andrea: you want more and more and more. To what end? You're still gonna die

[00:27:15] Carmen: Wait, did you, did you see, talking about bottomless pit in your soul, did you see Ivanka Trump talking about buying that island?

[00:27:23] Andrea: No.

[00:27:25] Carmen: Let me play it for you right

[00:27:26] Working on an incredible project with my husband in the Mediterranean. It's, it's massive in scale. We were on a friend's boat, and we stopped for a swim. Effectively, that's how we found it. We swam to the islands. We went on a hike, barefoot all the way, up to the top, and we were just captivated, and it stayed with us ever since.

[00:27:48] And over the course of, of many years, we developed the opportunity to help realize its potential and, and transform it, but with a lot of restraint and care because the land is so beautiful. Michael Lovett, after the Epstein debacle, and with Americans furious about inflation and the economy, would you have encouraged Ivanka Trump to do an interview about buying a private island?

[00:28:09] It's not a hotel, it's a- It, it'll be a hotel project. She talks about it like she discovered it, too. Like, the locals are like, "No, it's just protected because it's, like, a bird sanctuary." Yeah, Christopher Columbus over here. You, you found an uncharted island in the Mediterranean? In the Mediterranean. You think you found some place the Greeks missed?

[00:28:24] So the island in question, yeah, it's an uninhabited island in the Adriatic Sea called Sazan. Politico reported that Sazan sits in a very sensitive coastal area that's home to hundreds of species of birds, pelicans, flamingos, seals, and sea turtle nesting sites. I'm sure they loved Ivanka and Jared, like, just traipsing around.

[00:28:41] Yeah. So what's the drug deal that got this couple access to the island? So the land was protected. That somehow changed in 2024, and now it's made available for development. And Jared Kushner wants to develop a project that includes 10,000 hotel rooms. But earlier this week, Albania's Anti-Corruption Prosecution Office confirmed that they are investigating how these environmental protections were stripped away and the deal got a green light.

[00:29:05] Interesting. 

[00:29:05] Here's the problem, because here, here's the issue So disconnected. So disconnected from the plight of what people are going through, and she's acting as... And, and this is the part I love. She's acting as if she discovered the islands.

[00:29:24] Carmen: Like, me and my husband barefoot walking through. Like, what the fuck is wrong with you? Like, she's acting as if she fucking... But that's part of all of it, right? It's part of all of it. It's just this idea that more and more power and allowing all these people to continue living their lives while other people are suffering and can't even pay for gas, and eggs,

[00:29:49] Andrea: Yeah.

[00:29:50] Carmen: and everything else.

[00:29:51] Andrea: Yep.

[00:29:52] Carmen: Like, and I, I, I think that's what bothers me, too. Like, you know what? I think it'd be a great idea if I do an interview right now about the island I'm going to buy. I don't know, like, what PR strategy is that?

[00:30:06] Andrea: Uh, yeah, I don't know. I mean, it must be appealing to somebody.

[00:30:10] Carmen: All right. I wrote, I'll tell you later what I wrote down.

[00:30:16] Andrea: Not for public

[00:30:17] Carmen: All right, let's talk about, um... I was gonna talk about Trump's slush fund for the January 6th criminals, but I, you know, I guess that's already out the door now, so it doesn't really matter

[00:30:28] Andrea: um, uh, last I heard they were, the slush fund itself was out the door, but they're looking for other strategies to pay them.

[00:30:36] Carmen: So I just wanna understand this. People in, who still support Trump actually believe that the people that went and basically demolished our White House and were angry about the results of a legitimate election, even if you think the election was rigged, it was okay for them to go and do what they did in the White House, and so they were already pardoned even though some of them were in prison.

[00:31:05] Andrea: You mean the capital?

[00:31:07] Carmen: what?

[00:31:08] Andrea: The capital

[00:31:09] Carmen: Oh, it was the Capitol, not the White House. Yeah, right. Sorry, my,

[00:31:13] Andrea: The White House is fucked in other ways now, but

[00:31:15] we're talking 

[00:31:15] Carmen: the right. Oh my God, did you see those pictures? Anyways, and now we want to give them money for what? Their service to our country? I'm confused

[00:31:27] Andrea: I'm not quite sure on the, the stated rationale, but my belief is that this is how Trump has always gotten people on his side. "Well, let me just give them a sweetheart deal. Let me, let me try to get them some money so that they'll

[00:31:41] Carmen: But how do you not have a moral core? Why would you take dirty money? Like, why would you take money

[00:31:50] Andrea: These people don't have a moral core already. Like, what, why are we even questioning whether or not they have a mor- like, of course they're gonna take the money I mean, it's the, the Republicans, I mean, we can, we've talked about this ad nauseam, right? Who are going to allow it, you know? I

[00:32:10] Carmen: Yeah, that's the

[00:32:11] Andrea: back on the slush fund, but somehow they're gonna try to maneuver it and get some payments going. But

[00:32:18] Carmen: I guess, uh, you know what? I guess I'm just tired of having the same conversation. Not with you. I mean, like, 'cause to me, at the end of the day, it is the moral core. It's like why would... Yeah, okay. California's governor's race, let's just move on. Like, how are you feeling? Um, as of this morning, 'cause I checked, Steve Hilton, the Republican, has 27%.

[00:32:40] Becerra is at 25%, and Stier, quote unquote Democrat, is at 19%, and only 50% of the votes have been counted as of this morning.

[00:32:51] I just wanna say something to Republicans out there who are already starting the California is cheating and, changing the votes, 'cause I think Trump put something out, "Why is it taking so long to put out the votes?" California votes mostly by mail, and they have to open up all of the mail, and they have to check the signatures against, um, other rolls, which is why it's really hard to vote here if you do not have your ability to register to vote, but that's a whole other conversation.

[00:33:22] Uh, but also we wanna get it right. We don't wanna get it wrong, and we're a huge state. We're not Kentucky or whatever the fuck state you are that you have, like, 10 people in every county or whatever. Um, so yeah, it's gonna take us time and this is how it's always been, period, end stop

[00:33:41] Andrea: Yeah. Yeah. Yes to all of that, right? We do, it's, we know ahead of time, they always say we're probab- I, I heard it over and over again, we're probably not gonna know the results for at least a week because it takes so long to count all the mail-ins and all of that. I get... Like, where I'm at is, um, it's gonna sound really naive and you're gonna laugh at me, but, like, I am, I am legitimately bummed out that that many people voted for Republicans.

[00:34:15] You know what I mean? Like, uh, it... And Spencer Pratt too, like, you know, I know that's a separate, you know, LA mayor thing. Like, I'm just like, what... Do people not understand or care about the moment we're in? Like, I just, I'm bummed out about it. And not only that, I did a little bit of looking up myself this morning, and I was look- checking the LA County results, and s- thus far, 76% of eligible voters did not vote.

[00:34:43] Carmen: Mm-hmm.

[00:34:45] Andrea: Like, I wanna cry. I, like, what are you fucking doing, people? My daughter, my 17-year-old daughter who can't vote, personally got three people to the polls on election day, two of which none of them are registered, two of which she drove herself, and then she guilted another one into going and getting registered and voting, which is another thing, because you can register there.

[00:35:09] It takes a little while to verify, so. But, like, I'm just bummed out. I really am. I'm bummed out about kind of this overall state. Like, how, how, how are we not checked in?

[00:35:24] Carmen: I'll explain it. Happy to help. Like, I'm not defending it, but I think there's a couple of things that are happening. I think, 'cause I, I, I work for quite a few people, and I know they did not vote. I know most of the people in the office that I went to the other day, most of... I think there were four of us, and there's, like, 40 other people who did not vote.

[00:35:48] Do you know what I mean? And four of us were like, "Who'd you... Did you vote? Did you go..." You know what I mean? And, and I, I was not surprised at all. I think number one, um, we have taken democracy for granted for so long in this country. Like, people just do not understand that democracy does not... I- if you're not seeing it now, it's 'cause you've never seen it, how easily we can lose so many of our institutions and structures.

[00:36:14] That's number one. But we also don't make it easy for people to vote. You have to take time off from work, and I'm not making excuses for people, because you can vote by mail. But let's talk about that. There were 60 people running just for the governor's office, and what? 56 of them were bullshit,

[00:36:37] Andrea: Yeah.

[00:36:38] Carmen: right? On top of with all the judges, like I told you, I skipped two of the judges.

[00:36:45] There's a lot of research. We don't make it easy for people to vote. We don't make it easy for people to understand anything. Like, why is everything paper? How come we don't see a video or something of every p- like, why isn't there... I mean, I was thinking about all the easy ways in which we could maybe learn about the judges.

[00:37:04] You know? Like, I, I could swipe through all the judges and listen to a little bit about them and then go to their website with my QR code or whatever if I wanna learn more. But instead, I have to go Google, search them, figure out where they are. So there's a lot of reasons, not excuses, why I know why people don't go to vote, and that's just some of them.

[00:37:29] Andrea: Yep. I, I, I get it. I agree. I mean, God knows I complained about all the research I had to do over the last several weeks. Um, it's, it's a job. It's like a part-time job, truly. Um, it-- I'm just bummed out, man. I'm just bummed out that, like, that's a, that's, that's a huge number of people for,

[00:37:51] Carmen: Yeah

[00:37:52] Andrea: um, you know, decisions that are going to affect all of us.

[00:37:58] And we kind of ta- you know, there's the national elections that everyone kinda checks in on. The local elections are the ones that actually truly affect your daily life,

[00:38:08] Carmen: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

[00:38:09] Andrea: know? And, uh, you know, the go- the governor, the mayor, you know, those kinds of, your city

[00:38:14] Carmen: And,

[00:38:15] Andrea: council people.

[00:38:17] Yeah. 

[00:38:18] Carmen: and it is a domino effect. I mean, if voting for your local officials, then you see how it, it, it goes up. You know? Like Ted Lieu was... Ted Lieu is my representative here in Santa Monica, and he was just lambasting Marco Rubio the other day, right? 'Cause he was talking to him about, you know, basically what's up with your president, who's sleeping next to you while you're talking or whatever.

[00:38:39] And I was like, "That's my congressman. That's my cong- Go ahead, tell him." You know, like just watching him work and watching him get to the truth of something, like that's what happens. I know who my local congressman is, you know, and how he affects other people, my local representative. but yeah, I just, I agree with you.

[00:38:59] I think it's kinda sad that so many people didn't vote, and yet I get it. It's not an excuse, but we- we've taken it for granted is the big one

[00:39:10] Andrea: Yeah, we have definitely take it for, taken it for granted. It is definitely really hard, um, you know, like some of the kids that, that my daughter was trying to get to, to the polls were like, "Ah, like what is all of this?" You know? Like they look the... Whoops, sorry. They look at the thing, the, the, um, ballot and are like, "What the F?"

[00:39:29] You know? Like they don't know what even most of that stuff is. Yeah.

[00:39:33] Carmen: I think it's a tough one, yeah. Lookit, I, of course I agree with you 100%. I think that's why it's so important for the fall, so important. But again, a lot of people aren't gonna come out 'cause it's not a presidential race, and that's where we have to really change people's minds. It matters that you go out this November, hugely.

[00:39:56] Andrea: hugely.

[00:39:57] Carmen: Yeah, because if-

[00:39:59] Andrea: neutralize Trump, you gotta get out there in November

[00:40:04] Carmen: Yeah, and you have to vote blue, Democrat. I don't care. I know nobody... I don't care. I am telling you, you need to vote for every Democrat, and that's it. We need... 'Cause the reason why Trump is able to do what he's doing is because Republicans have enabled him and continue to enable him because they're all wusses.

[00:40:22] You notice they're all wusses until they get out of office because they lost their election. All of a sudden, this Tillis guy, this other guy, all of a sudden now they're like, "Really? Okay, now we're gonna say what we really wanna say." That should tell you everything. Cowards, complete cowards. You don't get no hero worship because now you gonna say something?

[00:40:46] See, this is the thing that I think is actually really eroding our country, is our moral core. I'm gonna keep saying it. The courage we need is now, not when you have lost your race. I mean, I'm glad that you're doing it then, but what's the point? What is the point of who you are in the world if it isn't when something bad is happening that you stand up?

[00:41:08] I don't get it. To me, it's an easy one. It's a fucking open book test. It's so easy. Do the right thing, not

[00:41:19] Andrea: When you actually have the power

[00:41:21] Carmen: Yes, they have all the power. Republicans are the reason why we are at war, your eggs are high, your gas is high, all of it. Why you... why we're having all these diseases creep in right now.

[00:41:35] We are having a height of diseases in this country because we have incompetent people running every sector of our government. That is Republicans' fault. Republicans are in charge of the House and the Senate. They are not keeping this man in check, the man who can't seem to stop thinking that taking all of these cognitive tests are actually a problem.

[00:42:04] He keeps talking about it 'cause he thinks they're IQ tests. They're not IQ tests

[00:42:12] Andrea: The IQ test is whether or not he thinks they're IQ tests.

[00:42:17] Carmen: Right? I know, it's so bad. Oh my God. And he's failing. Oh my God. Y- you know what? I... You're not gonna like what I'm gonna say. I do not wish ill will on Donald Trump, I don't. Like, I don't want him to keel over and, and I just, I don't, I don't want that, for so many reasons. But I wish people actually cared about that man enough to tell him, "You need to step down.

[00:42:49] You are not okay. Something is wrong." Like, but you don't really love him, you don't really care about that man. You don't give a shit, and for what you guys wanna say all about fucking Joe Biden, at the end of the day, he stepped the fuck down. You know what I mean? And it's like, God love him, I don't... I, I was gonna start talking about fucking Ja- Jake Tapper and fucking... But we ain't got that kind of time today.

[00:43:18] Andrea: No, we don't. We don't have time to dive into all that. Yeah, no, I... Look, look, it's,

[00:43:22] Carmen: If

[00:43:22] Andrea: if somebody had loved that motherfucker somewhere along the way, we wouldn't be where we are right now, and that's the problem

[00:43:28] Carmen: If somebody gave that man a fucking hug once. I've never seen him hug any- well, I've seen him hug Jeffrey Epstein, actually. Sorry

[00:43:37] Andrea: Seen him hug his daughter on his lap

[00:43:39] Carmen: No, no, no, but y- you, okay. All right. Well, we have gone all over the place, girl.

[00:43:49] Andrea: As usual.

[00:43:50] Carmen: As usual. All right. Um, thank you everyone for hanging out. I don't even know how to transition

[00:44:00] Andrea: I know. I'm sorry. I dropped a bomb on it

[00:44:04] Carmen: Oh, okay. At the end of the day, it really is all about the joy. We'll see you next time. Bye. That was so wrong. Okay

[00:44:16] Andrea: rolling