Bakeries, Star Trek, and Breaking Down Political Buzzwords

Ever feel like politicians and pundits are using words like socialism, communism, and social democracy as boogeymen without actually explaining what they mean? You aren't alone.

In this episode of Carmen Talk, Carmen takes a step back from the political noise to break down complex economic frameworks into simple, everyday terms. Prompted by an uplifting reminder of American hospitality from international World Cup visitors, Carmen dives into the definitions we hear tossed around daily—using simple analogies like a neighborhood bakery and iconic pop culture references like Star Trek: The Next Generation.

In this episode, we unpack:

• The Bakery Breakdown: What communism, socialism, social democracy, and capitalism look like using a simple bakery example.
• Star Trek & Democratic Socialism: How the world of Captain Picard models an ideal where basic human needs are met and individual achievement isn't driven by money.
• Social Democracy vs. Democratic Socialism: Why countries like Norway and Denmark thrive under capitalism paired with strong social safety nets.
• The U.S. Mixed Economy: Why our current system isn't pure capitalism and where our tax dollars actually go.
• Cutting Through the Division: Why understanding these terms helps us stop fighting over misinformation and focus on empathy, compassion, and taking care of each other.

Correction Note: During the conversation regarding DSA, the correct organization name is the Democratic Socialists of America (DSA).

Thank you for stopping by.  Please visit our website: All About The Joy and add, like and share.  

You can now watch the livestream version of the show on YouTube at @CarmenLezeth 

You can also support AATJ by shopping at our STORE - Or by and buying us a coffee. 

We'd appreciate that greatly.  

Also, if you want to find us anywhere on social media, please check out the link in bio page.

Music By Geovane Bruno, Moments, 3481
Editing by Team A-J
Host, Carmen Lezeth


DISCLAIMER:  As always, please do your own research and understand that the opinions in this podcast and livestream are meant for entertainment purposes only. States and other areas may have different rules and regulations governing certain aspects discussed in this podcast.  Nothing in our podcast or livestream is meant to be medical or legal advice. Please use common sense, and when in doubt, ask a professional for advice, assistance, help and guidance. 

Transcript

[00:00:09] Hi, everyone. Welcome to All About the Joy. I am Carmen Lezeth, your host, and this is Carmen Talk. So this is gonna be a little bit of a different conversation, and I really am torn because a part of me is like, "I don't wanna talk about this stuff," and then I think like, "Well, of course I'm gonna talk about this stuff because I think it might help people."

[00:00:33] I feel like anybody who's watching or listening to any show, of All About the Joy, our network, kinda knows my story and understands my ethos, right? At the end of the day, I think we're all pretty much more alike than unalike. I think that we all kinda sorta want the same things, right? We want to be able to make a decent living and have love in our lives and joy and be able to pay for things that are basic necessities.

[00:01:06] We want to be able to, you know, have a job and, um, put our kids through school or your kids through school 'cause I don't have any kids. But I think at the end of the day, if there's anything that I've learned in the past weeks where people who are here visiting our country from the World Cup is that the people of the United States are remarkable, beautiful human beings for the most part, right?

[00:01:37] And that this country is absolutely stunning and gorgeous. I mean, they kept saying that over and over again and that it's really big and the food and free refills. I mean, they were so funny, but the really important part that I can't seem to get out of my head is how lovely the people were. And I needed to be reminded of that because there has been so much division made between all of us, and, you know, look it, I'm not here to blame anybody for why we're in this division.

[00:02:06] I say we have to blame ourselves. We are responsible for this country.

[00:02:12] So I am taking full responsibility for not remembering how beautiful and wonderful this country is and the people in it. And I am grateful to people around the world who came here for the World Cup and reminded me of how magnificent our country really can be, especially when we're talking about the people.

[00:02:34] So I bring this up because if you've listened to Culture and Consequence this past week, one of the things I kept saying was I wish people would just learn, and I've been saying this over and over again, use Goog- Google, right? You know, read a book. I keep saying these things, and then I realize, you know what?

[00:02:51] People don't have time for that. People aren't listening to my show, why are they gonna go pick up a book? I mean, you should still pick up a book, and everybody should have a library card, 'cause seriously, it's free. And, um, and knowledge is power. But if you're here, why can't I just share with you some of the things I wish maybe we should all know?

[00:03:09] Or better yet, why not just present some stuff that maybe I was confused by as well? 

[00:03:16] here's, here's what I wanna say. Today we're gonna talk about a subject that I think is really, um, it's really hard. but it's something that keeps confusing people. So let's talk about it. The United States, what kind of economy are we? That's my question to you. Do you know? Do you know what a social democrat is?

[00:03:36] Are you sure? Do you know what a democratic socialist is? Same two words, flipped. Do you really know what a communist is? Do you know what a socialist is? Listen, I am doing this also for myself, because it is really hard to understand these terms unless you really study them and understand them. And even though I like to pride myself on saying that I read a lot or whatever, I was also confused by a lot of these words because they sound the same.

[00:04:12] And also, we have people who are just pushing these words out on us, not explaining them, but making them, like, boogeyman, like, bad and horrible. And it's just interesting once you dig in a little bit deeper into what each one of them are. So I'm going to share with you what I learned in this process Have some of you seen Star Trek: Next Generation?

[00:04:37] I'm sure you have. If you have ever watched one of our Friday night lives, you know that, Rick and myself are huge fans of Star Trek: Next Generation. We all love sci-fi, but that show and Stargate SG-1 are probably our favorites. But for the purposes of this conversation, let's talk about Star Trek: Next Generation.

[00:04:58] and for those of you who don't know this show, I'll give you another example in a moment. But for the most part, just imagine that it's the future, and we are on a ship. And on this ship, we have everything we need. We have access to a doctor, right? We have access to food. We can just ask the computer for food, or Earl Grey, as Captain Picard always asks the computer.

[00:05:20] there is an h- like an, a hierarchy because there are people who are captains, and there are people who are admirals and all that type of stuff, but there isn't something about money. Money is not the basis of why you are considered an important person or not. Everybody has the ability to achieve and to be their best selves based on who they are and how hard they work.

[00:05:46] And so in a lot of ways, it's this idealized kind of community where people are treated as equals, and the way in which you shine is based on your ability to achieve success. It's not, a race thing or a species thing in this case, right? Because there are so many different species that live on,uh, the spaceship.

[00:06:09] The Enterprise, I should say. Um, but even in the Federation planets. So the idea is that everybody is equal. Everybody has access to the things that they need, and the way in which you achieve success in this world is based on your achievements and your personal ability to be great at whatever it is you are great at.

[00:06:29] So that's why we have Captain Picard. He is the captain of the ship. He is the person that outranks everybody else, right? And there are just-- There, there's not all this stuffage, there's not all this stuffage about money, okay? This is the easiest and clearest example of what a Democratic Socialist is like.

[00:06:52] Now, I am being very basic here because someone's gonna come out and start screaming at me about something else. But all of this is just to get a different type of framework as to what it means, all of these different words that we're using. So somebody like Mayor, uh, Zaraan Mandami in New York, his whole vibe is kind of that.

[00:07:14] He doesn't want money to be the reason why you become successful, right? Th- th- there's a... And I, I don't mean to speak on his behalf, because even if he ideally wants that, he doesn't live in a country that does that, right? But the principles of what he's trying to do, which is like make sure there's daycare for everyone, or make sure there's healthcare for everybody, or make sure there's transportation for everybody, those are those still, those simple kind of basics that are on the Star Trek Enterprise spaceship.

[00:07:46] It's the same kind of concept. Now, the difference here with Democratic Socialist, okay, is that they really don't want anybody to have this power of money, right? They don't want anyone to have lots of money. Now, let's flip that word, Democratic Socialist, okay, and talk about what a social democrat is. 

[00:08:16] Now, I know those two words have the same words and they're flipped, and that's why it's so confusing. But a social democracy are like countries that I think a lot of us envy, right? A lot of us Americans may envy. Places like Sweden, Norway, Denmark.

[00:08:35] These countries believe in capitalism, so they believe that you can start your own, let's say, bakery. You can start your own business. You can be an entrepreneur. You can make as much money as you want. But when you pay your taxes, when you pay your ta- those taxes go to make sure we take care of the rest of our people.

[00:08:55] So what ends up happening is that I pay my taxes, and it goes to make sure that there are safety nets in place for all of the people. It doesn't mean I can't be a, a capitalist and make a lot of money in my bakery. Absolutely not. I can still be an entrepreneur. So as a social democracy, we believe in capitalism, just like these other countries.

[00:09:20] I can make as much money as I want, but my taxes go to things like healthcare. They go towards things like roads. They go towards things like making sure children have enough food to eat and that there are daycare programs. Social democracy, I think, is what people actually believe the United States is, but it's not.

[00:09:42] Like, you may not like the words because people have made it like the boogeyman type of thing, and they've done such a great job of scaring us half to death of what it could mean. But actually, if I spoke to most any normal, regular American anywhere in the, anywhere in the country, I think most people would say, "Well, yeah, I wanna make sure we take care of each other.

[00:10:08] I wanna make sure that the basics are, are taken care of for our people," right? Social democracies still believe in capitalism, and they also believe in making sure that we take care of each other, that our taxes go towards making sure everyone fundamentally has the basics of what they need. Again, if you've ever been to Norway or Finland or Denmark, these are countries that thrive.

[00:10:35] They absolutely thrive because they make sure everybody gets an education. You don't have to worry about student loans because you actually can get an education because it's part of what we do as a society, to take care of each other, to make sure we're educated. That is social democracy. Very different than what we were just talking about with Star Trek: Next Generation.

[00:10:59] Got it? Let's talk about what communism is, and let's use the bakery analogy. In a communist country,what would happen is I would not own the bakery.

[00:11:13] I would be told that I would have a bakery, and then I would be told what I could make in the bakery. I would be told exactly that I could only make croissants, uh, chocolate chip cookies, and muffins. I don't know. Clearly I'm not gonna be a very good baker. But I would be told those are the only things I can make, and the government, the state, would own the bakery.

[00:11:40] I would get whatever money I need to live on, but I would not make more or whatever. The government and the state would own the bakery. That, in a nutshell, is communism Communism eliminates the private markets completely, all for the government sector to be in charge and the state to be in charge of everything Communism is not in the United States today, and it will never be in our lifetimes, ever.

[00:12:16] In our... It's just goes against everything we believe in. It's, it's not even who we are as a people. Like, we couldn't even do it if we wanted to. We're not those people. So what is socialism? Let's talk about it. Socialism is different than communism in that using the bakery analogy again, what it does is it says the person that mixes the dough, and the person that sweeps up after them, and the person that is the waiter, and the person that comes in and opens the store and does the books, we all collectively own the bakery and equally own and share in the profit.

[00:12:58] That's what socialism is. It's more about all of the workers together deciding that we all are going to take care of each other and make sure that we all, participate in, any profits that come about from the bakery that we've established. It eliminates, actually, the private sector in that way as well.

[00:13:21] It moves private ownership from investors and shareholders to the community, to the workforce, right? So socialism is the idea that we, as a collective together, would own everything in the bakery, and we, as a collective, would share in all of that. So what is the United States? The interesting part about it is, is most people would say that the United States is a capitalist economy.

[00:13:50] But it's actually more of a mixed type of economy because although we do have a mixed economy, and even though we do have capitalism, right, which is the idea that, you know, you can be an entrepreneur. You can... I can create a bakery if I want. I can make whatever I want in the bakery. I can, sell it for whatever price I want because I wanna be competitive with the bakery across the street, right?

[00:14:15] Um, that is capitalism. The problem or the issue with it not really being pure capitalism, and the reason why it's a mixed bag, is because then we also have regulations that come into play, right? So, uh, the government will come in to make sure that I get an A, B, or C rating in my restaurant to make sure that I'm using the right kind of flour or the right kind of ingredients not to poison our people, right, when we sell stuff.

[00:14:45] Uh, so, so there's regulation, and that's a little bit more on the socialist side of things, right? Uh, I also pay taxes as this entrepreneur who owns this bakery, and so my taxes also go to paying for the, paved roads outside, right? And also to pay for the military. I don't have a choice as a person who makes all this money where my taxes go to, right?

[00:15:11] Also, if my bakery gets in trouble, like the banks did back in the day, the government may come in and bail me out if it's in the best interest of the economy. See what I'm saying? In the same respects, if you're a person who comes into my bakery, if you come in here and you don't have enough, maybe the government might have given you some SNAP benefits or welfare coupons or whatever they're called nowadays.

[00:15:40] When I was growing up, they were called food stamps. And you might come in to try to buy something from my bakery, but you can only buy white bread because the government has told you that you can only buy white bread with that SNAP benefit. It's a little communist if you're telling me, you know what I'm saying?

[00:15:57] Like, so, so there are parts of it that don't really ring true to this idea of pure capitalism. In the same respects, you know, if I make all of this money and the government decides that they need my, um, my shop to compete with another shop, they might buy a whole bunch of bakeries and big-time corpor- some big corporation will come in that's a chain.

[00:16:24] Amazon Bakery, let's say, is so big, like a Amazon Bakery. They might get it... The government might give the Amazon Bakery some incentives to turn around and open up down the block. You never know. There might be tax benefits in my state. And now, all of a sudden, my little bakery is not making as much money anymore and is barely holding on.

[00:16:51] So the irony of ironies here is that the United States is a mixed economy. We have very different types of things playing in how our economy works. I think most people believe we function more like Denmark and Norway and these other countries, and those are social democracies. But we do not, because we don't offer anything to take care of our citizens.

[00:17:24] And if anything, we mock people who are on SNAP benefits or food stamps or the like, right? We, we are not kind to our homeless people because we blame them for being homeless because they clearly must have messed up somewhere along the way to be in that position. That's their fault. I think people of the United States, in this country are actually far better people than we even realize that we are, but we are continuously being divided, and we are continuously being fed misinformation from people who continuously want to keep making more money as we fight amongst ourselves about stuff that isn't actually even happening.

[00:18:17] On Culture & Consequence, Andrea had brought it up once, and she's not wrong about this, but people in the United States believe that they are one or two or three decisions away from becoming a millionaire and being set for life, right? And I think that's part of what the American Dream has always kind of insinuated, if not boldly just told us straight up, that if you work really, really hard, you make all the right choices, and you do all the right things, you will be successful, and you will be okay, and you'll have your house with your white picket fence and your 2.5 children and a dog.

[00:18:53] And I know that's the ethos that a lot of people, especially in my generation, Generation X, has, has grown up believing or understanding or knew that's what their parents believed, right? We have the Norman Rockwell paintings, for example, that kind of depict those ideals, right? We have shows that we all grew up in, uh, watching, like Leave It to Beaver or I, or I forget what the other one is, but you know what I mean, those shows.

[00:19:19] I didn't really watch that show, but I'm just giving you the idea. There's also the show like The Cosby Show. I, I did watch that. You know, like if you work hard and you do all the right things, you too will be successful, right? Th- that, that whole concept is part of what makes us,thrive so much here in the United States, kinda sorta.

[00:19:36] But the truth is, the actual truth is, is that most of us, most, most of us are one or two or three bad accidents or medical emergency or losing a job, we're much closer to homelessness than we are to being millionaires. And I say that respectfully. It includes me, too. It's like if we understood that, if we understood that a lot of people that are homeless didn't want to be homeless, if we understood that, um, that most people who are drug addicted or are addicts, they don't necessarily want to do that.

[00:20:16] They are stuck there now. They are doing that because that's where they're at. Like, if we understood that a lot of people who fall into poverty, it's, is because big corporations are not paying livable wages. If we understood fully and completely and looked at our own selves not with a sense of like we're better than other people and we would never do A, B, C, and D, but instead see more that we are alike than unalike and have what I think is the essence of who we are as people in the United States, we have empathy and compassion for each other, we would understand that there but for the grace of God go I, 

[00:20:58] Or that it is only because I had this possibility that I am not stuck in that right now. Whatever it is you believe But the compassion of the people of the United States, I was reminded of that during this whole World Cup thing, and I can't let it go. And what makes me really sad is watching how much hatred there is for people who love this country.

[00:21:30] People like Zoran Mamdani, who-- and I keep saying his name wrong, so I apologize. Um, there's no excuse. It's Mamdani. I keep saying Mamdami with a M-I at the end instead of N-I. So Mamdani. So I apologize. Uh, I know I've said it a few times, actually. Um, but my point is this We have to deal with the fact that someone who is loving our country is doing what he said he would do,

[00:22:07] and he is, has no qualms whatsoever calling it what it is, which is he believes in a democratic socialist ideals, right? The Star Trek Next Generation idea of how the world could work. And look it, don't get me wrong, I think, I, you know, if, if I could choose to live in the world of the Federation and Star Trek Next Generation or where we're at today, I, mm, I'd probably wanna live in that world because I would know that I could thrive based on who I am and what I could do.

[00:22:39] And can you imagine living in a world where you didn't have to worry about paying your rent? Or you didn't have to worry about whether or not you got sick, you could just go and get like a quick shot or something, you know? Or you didn't have to worry about food because you, you would have access to food all the time.

[00:22:55] Like, I love that idea But I also love the idea that I could create something and also make extra money to do with what I wanna do, right? So that's why there's a part of me that also leans towards capitalism, right? So I actually prefer the ideals like Norway and Denmark, right? Which is social democracies, where I still have the access to capitalism and to being a, you know, someone who can be an entrepreneur and, and make as much money as I wanna make, but that I'm also making sure that I'm taking care of our people.

[00:23:32] I actually think that most Americans think that's what we do. And when I say Americans, I mean in the United States. I think that's what most people believe that we do, but we don't. We have a capitalist society, and it's a mixed bag. It's a very mixed economy that we have, and the way in which it works isn't-- It's not even about being fair.

[00:23:56] It's not honest. It's not honest. 'Cause we all have to pay taxes to make sure that we all have roads and access to transportation. I do. I want the TSA at the airports making sure that everybody who's going through is not bringing through a gun or a bomb or whatever.

[00:24:13] I want that. I want to make sure our roads are paved and done well. I do. I want that. I know you want that, too, you know? Um, but I would also like to think that our kids could go to school and could go to college if they wanted to, if that's... Or go to trade school or, or whatever and not have to worry about having $100,000 loan when they graduate that they may or may not be able to pay back, right?

[00:24:38] It would be great to think we lived in a society where you could go to school, or if I get sick, if I fall and break my l- my leg and, and, and I get rushed to the hospital in a helicopter because I was hiking, and... This actually happened to a friend of mine. The bill from that situation was almost $80,000 because they flew in a helicopter and had to get surgeries and, like, just it was ridiculous, you know?

[00:25:09] But, like, so the idea of never having to worry about that because my taxes as a entrepreneur, right? Who lives in United States, who believes in, uh, a social democracy and capitalism at the core of it, right? I would make sure that we take care of our people. I would not live or want to live in a world where I keep blaming everybody for everything when everything isn't everyone's fault.

[00:25:39] If we don't have the social safety nets available for people to fall, um, then how do you expect them to get back up? How do you expect people to get back up over and over and over again when there's nothing there to lean on? When there's nothing there to just try to get back up? And why would we want that for people?

[00:26:02] I think we need to start understanding a few things, okay? One of them is we are so much better than what we have become, and I know that's from a movie. I just can't remember where. Um, we're so much better than this, and I wish we could see that. Please, I beg of you, stop listening to places like Fox News, please.

[00:26:27] Or at the very least, if you're gonna watch Fox News, watch another-- Go to the opposite channel, like MSNBC or something, and watch the opposite as well. You know? Like, if you're gonna go to extremes, do that, but- The amount of BS that is being thrown our way on a regular basis to keep separating us, to keep us fighting over things that are non-issues, that are not important, is incredible.

[00:26:55] And it's not that socialism, communism, democratic socialist, and social democracies are not important. What is important is to understand what they are, and that people are not throwing those words out and not using them correctly. And they're doing it because they know it's confusing you. They know it's confusing you.

[00:27:17] And I listen to people talk about communism, and they're actually talking about social democracies. Like, they, and they don't even realize it I listen to people, you know. Somebody wrote in one of my comment sections that, you know, Zoran Mandani is part of the DSA, the Democratic Social Association or whatever, and I'm like, "Oh, so?"

[00:27:42] He can be part of whatever he wants because this is the United States of America, and in this country you can belong to whatever group you want. Just because he belongs to that group and just because he believes in the principles of Star Trek Next Generation doesn't mean that he's a bad person. He's actually just trying to get us away from this profit-based system that seems to be hurting more people than doing any good.

[00:28:08] We're, we're never gonna be a democratic socialist country because he was actually elected in a capitalist... See how it gets a little confusing? He actually got elected by the people. But he is trying to get the core principles of what it means to help other people and to make sure that it's not always all about profit first and instead about people first.

[00:28:34] H- how is that a bad thing? We can include that in our mixed economy. It's not communism. It's not socialism. And that's what I'm saying is let's stop being hoodwinked into believing things that are not true. Let's learn the words. If you hear somebody say a word, any politician, especially politicians... And I don't know why y'all believe in every single politician, but if you hear a politician say a word and you cannot define that word by definition and with an example like a bakery or whatever, if you can't dumb it down and explain it to a 10-year-old, then you don't understand it enough and you shouldn't believe that politician.

[00:29:16] And instead, you should go do your homework and learn it and understand it. And if you're not gonna do that, then don't repeat it. It's one of the best things I've ever learned in my entire life. Do not talk about what you don't know. Anyways, thank you everyone for hanging out. I know that was kind of like an academic, boring conversation.

[00:29:39] I hope it wasn't boring. I hope it was at least a little bit educational and make you dive deeper and learn more stuff, not just about what those words mean, but what is happening with our politicians right now who keep trying to divide us instead of bring us together. Bringing us together is what a real leader would do.

[00:30:00] A real leader would find the joy and the possibility and the silver lining and show us what can happen, not keep pushing other people down to lift themselves up. And we know that We know that as Americans in the United States. And if we have forgotten, which I kinda had, then I am thankful to the rest of the world that came here during the World Cup who turned around and reminded me that the people of the United States are amazing.

[00:30:28] We're great people, and we still have potential and possibility. We just have to take our country back, and I don't mean that, like, against Trump or so- I mean, in general, remember who we are and remember who we can be, and move forward from there. Thank you everyone for hanging out and listening to CarmenTalk.

[00:30:51] Please remember, All About The Joy is a network of four different shows. So here is CarmenTalk, and this happens on a pretty regular basis, and it's always my 20 minutes or so on a topic of my choosing. But Friday Night Lives, everyone is welcome to come and hang out, and it is a live broadcast on Friday nights at 6:00 PM Pacific, 9:00 PM Eastern.

[00:31:16] You can come up if you want or you could just be in the chat, but we welcome everyone. If you're not doing anything on a Friday night, come and hang out with us. We'd love to have you. Culture and Consequence is a conversation between two friends, me and Andrea, usually talking about politics or the cultural-esque moments of the day.

[00:31:34] And, uh, this is... Usually we have a weekly conversation since I've always known her. We t- have a little chit-chat. We just decided to film it and, and share it with everyone, and it's kind of become a funnyism that I wasn't expecting. So that's kinda cool. And then of course we have The Private Lounge, and The Private Lounge is, uh, where we have our intimate conversations with people in the community, and we have a really great interview coming up in the next few weeks, and I'm really excited about it, an amazing artist who we're gonna have on the show, uh, who talks a lot about things I know nothing about.

[00:32:09] And so it's a great learning moment for me, too. So that's The Private Lounge. Anyways, thank you again for hanging out. We appreciate you, and remember, at the end of the day, it really is all about the joy. Bye everyone. Thanks for stopping by All About The Joy. Be better and stay beautiful, folks. Have a sweet day.